EP. 110 — Virtual Dominatrix

[00:01:22] CHRIS: [music transition] Hello to all my footwear enthusiasts. It’s Beautiful Anonymous one hour, one phone call. No names, no holds barred.

[00:01:34] THEME MUSIC: I’d rather go one on one. I think it’ll be more fun. And I’ll get to know you and you’ll get to know me.

[00:01:45] CHRIS: Hello and welcome to another episode of Beautiful Anonymous. A podcast where its phone calls. But it’s more than just phone calls, isn’t it? It’s conversations, but it’s more than that. It’s people. It’s real people telling real stories. It’s all about letting our guard down. And then it’s a whole community of, people listening. And once those things connect, it’s turned into something very special in my life. Thank you all for listening. Allowing it to happen. Thanks to everybody who’s been supporting the Chris Gethard show on TruTV. It means a lot that so many of you guys are giving it a chance. I know it is far from the same vibe as Beautiful Anonymous but a lot of you guys have checked it out and it means a lot to me. And also, I’m going out on the road. I’m doing a bunch of standup dates. Chrisgeth.com, Thanks to everybody who’s been checking that out and showing excitement about those things. Very cool of you. I wanted to mention last week’s episode was a very hard one and a very fascinating one. It seemed like that was the vibe in all the online feedback I saw, I got tons of tweets. Saw a few people actually wrote articles and blog posts about that one. Seems like you’ve got a cool dialog going too. The Beautiful Anonymous Facebook group… There were a lot of people who really were wrapping their head around it. I thought this was a good representative comment. This was from Alicia. Alicia said, “This was hard. I continually challenged myself to think, ‘What if this was a girl saying the same thing?’ That really brought it into perspective. It’s not comfortable or expected to hear males talk about this. But if it were a female in the same situations, I’d be horrified.” Caller, I am in awe of your bravery. Thank you for sharing a story we don’t often hear, but need to. A lot of people, especially the last two stories, the caller…A lot of people going, “Wow, sexual assault can happen to men in that same way.” One comment that simply said, “This happens to dudes more often than you know.” I’m glad that one’s holding it up in a nice way. Also want to say a huge, massive thank you to the moderators of the Beautiful Anonymous Facebook community online. You know, that’s a group with close to 30,000 people now and it’s really active. And I think that’s beautiful. And I thank you guys for being part of it. To my knowledge, this is one of the biggest online communities surrounding a podcast there is. End of story. And that’s hard to wrangle. And that was a hard call. And there was a lot of divisive stuff. And the moderators really stepped up and were on top of it. And it means so much to me that they help out. So thank you guys all so much. Thank you guys all so much. I know that was a hard week for you guys having to look our for all that stuff. Anyway. This week’s episode. Sex work. What’s the definition of that? I tell you, we talk about it and I… You’ll hear, I am continuously in this call trying to wrap my head around it. I didn’t… There’s a whole underground economy. A whole underground world revolving around sex. And it comes in many forms. And I didn’t know that. And this caller experiences that and participates in that in ways that I didn’t quite know existed. And this caller lays it all out. And it is fascinating to me. And I tell you, the caller was really just in the thick of it, but had such a good ability to communicate it and a good sense of humor about it. And it was eye opening. It  was eye opening. And baffling. And also just totally in some ways, and I say this without any judgment, there’s just a strange world online, man. Just a strange world online. You hear all about that and more. Enjoy the call.

[00:05:26] PHONE ROBOT: Thank you for calling Beautiful Anonymous. A beeping noise will indicate when you are on the show with the host. [beep]

[00:05:34] CHRIS: Hello?

[00:05:35] CALLER: Hello?

[00:05:36] CHRIS: Hi.

[00:05:37] CALLER: Oh, my God. Oh, my God, my back just got all sweaty.

[00:05:41] CHRIS: Your back just got all sweaty? Is that how we’re starting today?

[00:05:44] CALLER: Oh, my God. Is this Chris?

[00:05:47] CHRIS: Yeah, it’s Chris. What’s up with your sweaty back?

[00:05:49] CALLER: Oh, my God. It’s in my top drawer. Oh, my God. I’m going to cry.

[00:05:55] CHRIS: What’s in your top drawer? What’s in your top drawer?

[00:06:00] CALLER: A coworker of mine has a migraine and needs some help, so.

[00:06:04] CHRIS: Oh, nice. So some sort of…

[00:06:07] CALLER: Yeah. I’m like the pharmacy of my work.

[00:06:10] CHRIS: Got it. Got it. Understood. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:06:14] CALLER: Oh, wow. Okay. I was like literally about to hang up.

[00:06:18] CHRIS: Well, I’m glad you didn’t because now we get to talk for an hour. Or if you hang up less than that.

[00:06:25] CALLER: I mean, I don’t imagine that you’ll say anything to make me want to hang up.

[00:06:29] CHRIS: Well, that’s good. I do want to just say, both for you and anybody listening the future, you’ll notice this one sounds a little different. I’m actually at my office at the Chris Gethard Show. I’m not in the studio today. So if you notice some weird sound stuff…

[00:06:43] CALLER: Oh, you gotta work today?

[00:06:45] CHRIS: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Never get to leave this place. That’s what you get for following your dreams. Well that’s what she get for following your god damn dream.

[00:06:56] CALLER: Yeah. Yeah, that sucks. You have to like work at it. Everybody thinks it’s gonna be so easy and it’s not.

[00:07:03] CHRIS: You end up working 12 hours a day every day. Getting yelled at. Getting yelled at by everybody all the time. Stay in your office. Stressed out on the verge of an anxiety attack. For your dream.

[00:07:14] CALLER: I mean. I won’t yell at you. Probably.

[00:07:19] CHRIS: That’s very nice of you. I won’t yell at you either. Maybe. I don’t know. Neither of us can make that promise, actually.

[00:07:26] CALLER: Oh, my God. Okay, hold on. I need to to take my cardigan off. Literally, like, I don’t know why that happened. I’m literally like, so sweaty. Okay, I’m fine.

[00:07:34] CHRIS: You went from sweaty to fine real quick right there.

[00:07:37] CALLER: Yes, it’s fine. It’s all fine.

[00:07:39] CHRIS: Great. Good.

[00:07:41] CALLER: Sure. I’m assuming that they told you a little bit about what I was going to talk about.

[00:07:47] CHRIS: Not really. Not really. What do we got here?

[00:07:53] CALLER: Well, I am a little bit behind. I’m not officially caught up on all the new… I think I’m like three episodes behind. But the last one that I listened to was a guy was a little bit involved in like sex work, I think.

[00:08:11] CHRIS: Uh-Huh. I remember that.

[00:08:13] CALLER: And I am actually more part-time now, but I was really involved in sex work. So I thought maybe it might be a little interesting to get an an actual sex worker’s perspective on how that is.

[00:08:32] CHRIS: Well, I’m all ears. My ears have perked up. So you were a sex worker. You said you still part-time dabble, it sounds like.

[00:08:41] CALLER: Yeah. I mostly do, like femme dom and sugar daddy sugar baby relationships right now just because I’m finishing school and working full-time. So I had to cut back a little bit on it.

[00:08:55] CHRIS: Yeah. So you got exams coming up. That means less sugar daddy.

[00:09:01] CALLER: I’m on my last term.

[00:09:03] CHRIS: So, femme dom…

[00:09:05] CALLER: I’m so excited.

[00:09:06] CHRIS: I’m a pretty… Okay. So first of all, you should know, I’m a very open minded guy, very liberal guy. Have opinions on sex work. And, no shame with this guy right here. Say whatever you please. I got your back. Other thing I’ll say, just to… In my mind, femme dom means stuff that maybe we’d all, you know… People who aren’t in this world would view as like sort of on the dominatrix end of things?

[00:09:32] CALLER: Yeah, basically.

[00:09:34] CHRIS: Submissive men paying you to live out their submission fantasies?

[00:09:39] CALLER: Basically. I mostly try to stay virtual just because I am a very tiny person. So safety is very, very important to me because I’m not going to be kicking anybody’s ass anytime soon.

[00:09:57] CHRIS: Wait, stay virtual? So you mean like the actual meeting, like the actual sessions take place online?

[00:10:05] CALLER: Yeah, it’s real, real interesting. You wouldn’t think that you could do so much over the phone or the computer. But yeah, you actually get some interesting requests. I mean, you do in person, too.

[00:10:21] CHRIS: Okay. Okay. I’m writing down 85 questions. Give me a second to write down everything. So is it exclusively virtual or do you… I will say, the femme dom one I can see a lot easier cause I could see people who are very fetish driven. But the sugar daddy… You have online sugar daddy relationships or do you sometimes meet with these guys and have sex?

[00:10:49] CALLER: I have actually never had sex with a sugar daddy.

[00:10:54] CHRIS: What?

[00:10:56] CALLER: Yeah. I’ve never actually had sex with a sugar daddy. Even the ones that I do meet up with. There’s one that I hang out with in person but all the rest of them… I have four other ones.

[00:11:09] CHRIS: So you have five sugar daddies. Four of them have never met you in real life. They only, I assume, Skype or Face Time or Google Hangouts, whatever your video app of choice is.

[00:11:21] CALLER: One of them is over Kick. Like, solely. I send pictures sometimes. But the other ones, yeah, we have Skype sessions.

[00:11:32] CHRIS: And one of them you just meet up and you hang out.

[00:11:36] CALLER: Yeah, we hang out. It’s still like, I know that I’m like into it, sort of like as a side career. But it’s still so weird calling somebody “Daddy” to me. Like the one that I hang out with in particular likes calling me “Mommy”  and I just have to, like, hide a shudder every time he does it.

[00:12:00] CHRIS: So your job is mostly just to keep a poker face as horny men with fetishes objectify you as the person who will fulfill their fetish.

[00:12:15] CALLER: You know, it’s it’s a lot less sexual than you would expect.

[00:12:20] CHRIS: Really?

[00:12:22] CALLER: Yeah. Like the one that I hang out with in person, part of the reason I hang out with him is because he’s such a softy. He’s like a little tiny queer bear.

[00:12:34] CHRIS: He’s a tiny, little queer bear? I’m so confused by all of this. I am confused by all of this! He’s a tiny little queer bear?

[00:12:42] CALLER: That’s why I want to talk about it. People have very weird conceptions about it. About sex work. It’s so funny. I love talking about it. Because people are always so surprised.

[00:12:51] CHRIS: So you’re pretty open about this in your life?

[00:12:56] CALLER: I try to be as much as I can. Just because I want to work to end the stigma around it. I’m really interested in politics. I’m going to school for political science. And I remember when I first came out to my family as being a cam model, like a couple of years ago, and my parents were like… Because my parents and I are very open and they’re very liberal too. So when I told them I didn’t think it would be a big deal and my dad was like, “Well, you realize you can’t go into politics now, right?”

[00:13:31] CHRIS: That seems like it’s actually fine. Seems like it’s actually kind of like a party of politics.

[00:13:39] CALLER: Yeah, so yeah. So really it’s politically motivated. Like everything else.

[00:13:44] CHRIS: Yeah. See, you’re doing it for the resumé down the line.

[00:13:48] CALLER: I do. Yeah. I do it on principle.

[00:13:51] CHRIS: So how do you find your clients if this is all online?

[00:13:58] CALLER: Well, I mean, I’m sure some people might be surprised, but I actually started out on Reddit. I started out like posting pictures. It really actually started out sort of like a self esteem boost for me. Like, I’ve always had like… I wouldn’t say you like body image issues, but I am sort of the person that’s like, you know, the phrase like, “Oh, she’s got a great personality.” I’ve always applied that to myself because, you know, like I never really thought of myself as beautiful. I mean, I think I’m okay. I kind of look like a… I don’t know. I think I look a little bit like a dude, but. I don’t know. Anyway.

[00:14:45] CHRIS: Okay. That’s fine.

[00:14:47] CALLER: So it started out as like, you know, sort of getting to accept my body and like it. And I didn’t even think anything would come of it. But as soon as I started posting, I started getting messages. And it wasn’t even the messages that necessarily built up the confidence. It was literally just the fact, like, I was seeing myself through other people, and I was like, “Oh, yeah. Like, you know, maybe having small boobs isn’t actually that bad. Like, maybe guys actually, you know, guys and girls actually do like small tits.” Like, it’s kind of cool.

[00:15:23] CHRIS: So were you posting… I’ll just cop to this because I… I’m on record about this. Were you posting on Gone Wild? Because I’m familiar with Gone Wild. I’ve dabbled. I’ve never posted, but I know Gone Wild. Is that where it began?

[00:15:38] CALLER: Well, I’m disappointed.

[00:15:40] CHRIS: What’s that?

[00:15:41] CALLER: You got to do it because that self-esteem… I’m disappointed. You gotta do it for that self-esteem boost.

[00:15:46] CHRIS: You’re recommending that I… Cause for anyone who doesn’t know… Okay, let’s just… Okay. We’ll just put it out there. Gone Wild is a subreddit where people post nude images of themselves. And it’s kind of an infamous thing in the Reddit world. I’d say people can become Reddit famous, if not Internet famous if they blow up on Gone Wild. People post the nude images and I’ve talked about it in public. I think someone once called the Gethard show and was like, “Kind of porn, do you like?” And I was like, “I’m not ashamed. I like Gone Wild because I know people are posting it on their own and I know there’s no exploitation.” And I know it’s not… You know, I’m sure some people have some issues, but in general, it seems a little more above Bored and Empowered. So I actually know Gone Wild. There’s a chance, not to get awkward. There is a chance I have seen pictures of you naked. There’s a chance I’ve seen your boobs. Yeah. Yeah, that’s true.

[00:16:42] CALLER: Yeah, that’s a chance. That’s the thing.

[00:16:45] CHRIS: There’s a decent percentage chance. So did so did you blow up a little on Reddit?

[00:16:52] CALLER: You know, I mostly was on like Petite Gone WIld. There’s a subreddit called Tiny Tits if you know that. I made a big boom there.

[00:17:04] CHRIS: You did. Made a big splash in Tiny Tits. Made a real big splash in Tiny Tits.

[00:17:08] CALLER: Well, I guess I made a tiny splash.

[00:17:12] CHRIS: So you’re a big fish in a tiny tit pond.

[00:17:15] CALLER: Exactly.

[00:17:16] CHRIS: Wow.

[00:17:18] CALLER: Actually, when I was a kid, we would like make superhero names for ourselves. I guess not really kids, we were in like middle school. But my superhero name was Anti-Boob.

[00:17:28] CHRIS: No, wow. Anti-Boob.

[00:17:30] CALLER: I know. They’ve grown a little bit.

[00:17:36] CHRIS: So you’re putting your pictures in these forums. Because maybe you’ve got low self-esteem. People start responding positively. You start gaining momentum and people are following you. And then what happens? People start reaching out and offering you money?

[00:17:55] CALLER: Well, so initially I got a lot of questions about like, “Do you cam? Do you do private sessions? Do you do private Skype sessions? Do you have a Snapchat?” Like those kinds of things. And I had never actually really heard of camming. Like my partner would watch cam models on like Chatter Bait. And I’m bi, so you know, we would watch it sometimes together. And I was like, oh, my God, this is kind of cool. Like, you know, like it’s a site where people are only on there if they want to be, you know what I mean? And they can just do whatever they want. And so when people started suggesting I get an account, I was like, man, I mean, sure, if you guys want it. So that’s kind of what started it. I made a website. I made a Snapchat account. People generally had to pay for it. I had sort of like a little grace period where people that were like my original fans got it for free. But after a certain point, people had to start paying for it. And I started camming.

[00:19:08] CHRIS: And is that good money?

[00:19:11] CALLER: It can be. It was for a while. I mean, I was unemployed for a couple of months and it pretty much paid all of my bills. Which is not cheap where I live.

[00:19:22] CHRIS: Wow. That’s rad.

[00:19:24] CALLER: Yeah, it was really cool. It’s a little awkward because like, for the most part, like you can’t, like, see the people you’re interacting with. The only way you can really talk with them is like, you know, over chat. And so you’re kind of sitting in your room with a camera pointed at you and you’re just sitting by yourself, like just sitting there and you have to sort of make your own show.

[00:19:57] CHRIS: Yeah.

[00:19:58] CALLER: I mean, you probably know what that’s like. You’re a comedian. You have to sort of decide how you’re going to entertain all of these people just staring at you. Except it’s a little scarier because you’re naked.

[00:20:07] CHRIS: Wow.  I never thought about that… that being a cam model, you do have to work the crowd. You do have to keep the crowd engaged. You got to keep them focused on you. You gotta make sure they don’t just start talking amongst themselves and that you’re kind of defining the momentum of the experience so that it’s on your terms and not theirs. We have that in common.

[00:20:27] CALLER: Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, I think that’s sort of where I got the… So I’m a really big feminist. I’m a huge feminist. And I also try to be as not misandrist as possible. I try really hard not to hate men. It’s really hard when you start learning about the patriarchy. And so I think maybe that is what fueled the femme dom part of me, if that makes sense.

[00:21:02] CHRIS: So if guys want to pay for you to… For you to insult them and make them lesser, that’s fun for you too.

[00:21:13] CALLER: Right. I think men should give me all of their money. They don’t need it. It’s going to go to… I’m like the Robin Hood of sugar babies.

[00:21:24] CHRIS: So you’re just taking money from as many men as you can to put it in your terms. This money will go back into the economy based on your decisions.

[00:21:35] CALLER: And then I also sort of become like a sugar momma to all of my friends. And it’s really cool because, you know, like I’ve been sort of doing that with some of my friends. Like I have some friends that have some self-esteem problems. And I’m like, “Dude, I’m going to buy you some lingerie. I’m going to get a Polaroid camera and we’re gonna do a photo shoot and you’re gonna feel fucking awesome.” And it works. It’s really fun. And I don’t have to pay for a fucking thing.

[00:22:01] CHRIS: Wow. So you’ve started to build like a network of friends who are all participating in this together.

[00:22:11] CALLER: Yeah. My friends think it’s hilarious.

[00:22:14] CHRIS: Now, okay. First of all, good call. Second of all, like I said, so many questions. I want to just ask some of the basic questions. First one being, for Kick,  I’ve never had Kick. My understanding is that it’s mostly a text based… It’s like a texting app. Right? Like it’s almost like a WhatsApp type thing. Is it a little more anonymous…

[00:22:37] CALLER: Yeah, ’cause you don’t have to like have your number.

[00:22:39] CHRIS: Okay. Okay. So WhatsApp reveals your phone number. Kick does not.

[00:22:44] CALLER: Yeah, well, I mean, it’s connected to your phone number. Like, to use WhatsApp you have to have their phone number associated with it. Whereas with Kick you don’t have to.

[00:22:52] CHRIS: Okay, that’s good. And I like that this is becoming an instructional guide on how to participate in anonymous online virtual sex. This episode is going to get some downloads.

[00:23:03] CALLER: Oh, Chris. I have power points.

[00:23:05] CHRIS: Oh, send me the link. Send me the link. My Reddit name is Chris Gethard. Easy to remember. So you have these relationships. Do people pay you like a monthly fee? Is it per a session? Is it a certain number of exchanges that they get before you have to cut them off?

[00:23:25] CALLER: It depends sort of on what we want to do. So for example, Bear, the one that I hang out with in person, we… Generally how he and I work is he’ll pay to hang out with me. So if he wants to come over and watch Queer Eye with me for a couple hours, you know, I usually charge like a hundred bucks an hour. So that ends up being like a couple hundred bucks.

[00:23:52] CHRIS: He pays you 100 dollars an hour to sit on your couch and watch Netflix with you.

[00:23:57] CALLER: Yeah. I mean, I play with his hair sometimes.

[00:24:00] CHRIS: You play with his hair? That’s honest to God as far as it’s gone?

[00:24:05] CALLER: Yep. I mean, like I’ve hugged him before.

[00:24:08] CHRIS: You’ve had what before?

[00:24:10] CALLER: I’ve hugged him before, you know? I’ve given him a hug.

[00:24:15] CHRIS: And he gives you a hundred dollars an hour?

[00:24:17] CALLER: Yeah. Or like the thing I like about him is I can pretty much just hit him up whenever and just be like, “Hey, I want to order Postmates. Can you give me 30 bucks?” And he’ll be like, “Yes, of course, queen”. And you know, and then I have 30 bucks.

[00:24:32] CHRIS: I have to tell you, Harry and Jared are in my office with me as we tape this. All three of us are sitting here with what can only be described as the most bewildered looks on our faces.

[00:24:47] CALLER: You know, that’s honestly the face that I have when I get it.

[00:24:50] CHRIS: How did you get this sweet ass gig?

[00:24:53] [AD BREAK]

[00:27:28] CALLER: Honestly, it’s bizarre, isn’t it? I think it’s because I’m a nice person. I mean, like…

[00:27:40] CHRIS:  Do you just laugh all the way to the bank?

[00:27:41] CALLER: I listen to them. I mean, to myself, I don’t laugh to them. That would be so mean.

[00:27:49] CHRIS: Right.

[00:27:51] CALLER: But I mean, I’m a fairly emotionally intelligent person. So a lot of it is like, you know, there’s like actually a lot of emotional labor that people don’t really think about that goes into sex work. Like a lot of sex workers will tell you that it’s really not about  the sex. Like sex is kind of a misnomer. Like, of course, people are there to like see you naked and whatever. But a lot of the time, it’s people that just want to have conversations and just want to talk about like… So Bear, he is, like the example I’ll use, like he’s in a relationship. And a lot of the time he’ll talk to me about like, “Hey, like my girlfriend is going through like some PTSD stuff from her abusive acts, like what’s a way that I can help her? You know, like, how can I help her adjust to this? What can I do to be a good partner to her?” And I sort of counsel him.

[00:28:46] CHRIS: So it’s almost like a therapy relationship.

[00:28:50] CALLER: Yeah. I mean, it’s really just like, you know, like I don’t take on clients that I wouldn’t be friends with because you really do have to have some sort of an authentic relationship.

[00:29:00] CHRIS: Yeah.

[00:29:01] CALLER: You know what I mean? Like, you can’t fake it. Like people that are just… Because I mean, I’m in it obviously for the money. It’s awesome. But I’m also in it because I think that a lot of men just really want emotional connection and want to learn how to have emotional connections with other people. And that’s why I do it. You know, it’s like 60/40.

[00:29:28] CHRIS: Okay, and how much do you get paid for the virtual only sessions, these Kick relationships?

[00:29:34] CALLER: Well, the one on Kick that I have, his is generally like a monthly stipend, so he’ll send me… I would say like… It’s usually like two to three thousand dollars a month.

[00:29:50] CHRIS: What?!

[00:29:51] CALLER: But that’s for like…

[00:29:54] CHRIS: What?!

[00:29:55] CALLER: That’s actually not that much.

[00:29:57] CHRIS: Yes it is!

[00:29:59] CALLER: Well, I mean it is. But it’s not like that much compared to like some of the other girls.

[00:30:04] CHRIS: That’s more than my mortgage.

[00:30:07] CALLER: Oh, my God. I’m sorry.

[00:30:09] CHRIS: You’re getting…

[00:30:10] CALLER: Do you want to get in on this?

[00:30:12] CHRIS: Yeah! What do I gotta do? How?

[00:30:16] CALLER: I’ll just hand over my Kick account to you.

[00:30:19] CHRIS: A Chris Gethard – The guy from Beautiful Anonymous – The Takeover. All the sudden people start getting pictures of a different kind. Wait, how many hours are you working? How much of an investment of your time are you giving over for two to three thousand dollars a month? And that’s for one person or total amongst those four?

[00:30:38] CALLER: That’s just for the Kick.

[00:30:40] CHRIS: That’s just for one?

[00:30:41] CALLER: That’s for… Yeah that’s for, we call him Papi.

[00:30:45] CHRIS: So there’s a guy named Papi who gives you two to three grand a month, which is more than…

[00:30:51] CALLER: Yeah, but I mean that’s so that he can talk to me anytime he wants. I mean, like day or night, 24/7.

[00:30:58] CHRIS: Okay. Great. But to…

[00:31:02] CALLER: It’s a lot of effort.

[00:31:04] CHRIS: Yeah. Okay. Let’s be honest, let’s be honest.

[00:31:09] CALLER: People are so exhausting, Chris. Men are so exhausting. Like conspiring, not to get into them misandry, but do you realize how exhausting, emotionally unintelligent men are? like. It’s so much effort.Like, it’s so much effort.

[00:31:25] CHRIS: Oh, for sure. But I mean, I think emotionally… I think there’s people in general who are exhausting, right? I’ve had relationships with exhausting females.

[00:31:34] CALLER: I do find people exhausting.

[00:31:36] CHRIS: Yeah. Humans in general.

[00:31:37] CALLER: Yeah.

[00:31:38] CHRIS: But then there’s a lot of good ones. Two to three grand a month from Papi?!

[00:31:45] CALLER: Yeah. It’s pretty nice.

[00:31:46] CHRIS: Why are you even working a day gig?

[00:31:49] CALLER: Because I want the benefits and I also sort of like having stability if that makes sense. Like not that they aren’t stable necessarily, but I like knowing that I am providing myself with money. And it’s also for the health insurance.

[00:32:09] CHRIS: Right. And there’s also the chance, I would imagine, that this dries up at some point.

[00:32:16] CALLER: Right. Exactly. That’s sort of why I stopped camming.

[00:32:19] CHRIS: Listen, you and I are recording this two days before tax season and there’s a high percentage chance that Papi’s accountant in two days opens up his filie and goes, “Hey Papi! The fuck is this thirty six thousand dollar expense for you to talk to someone?!”

[00:32:39] CALLER: I’m not too worried about Papi.

[00:32:40] CHRIS: So Papi’s a fucking billionaire.

[00:32:42] CALLER: I should be asking him for a lot more. He gets off easy.

[00:32:49] CHRIS: So this guy, like…

[00:32:50] CALLER: I remember…

[00:32:51] CHRIS: Is Papi Bill Gates?!. What’s going on?!

[00:32:54] CALLER: Right. I actually.., I let him stay a little bit more anonymous just because I think he is a little bit more like a higher end client. So I like to afford him some privacy, which is why I refer to him as Papi.

[00:33:13] CHRIS: So that’s all you know him as?

[00:33:16] CALLER: Yeah. I remember the first time I realized like, holy shit, this guy is not joking. When he showed me, he like walked… like did a video walk through of his like, I don’t even feel like apartment is the right word. There has to be a word for like apartment mansion because. Oh, my God. It was like eight rooms with like a living room that’s bigger than my apartment. Like, Oh my God. I wanted to kill myself. I was like, “Where’s mine?”

[00:33:49] CHRIS: So, all told, all five guys on average, how much you pulling down a month for the sugar daddy relationships?

[00:33:59] CALLER: Gosh, I’m so bad at math, which I really shouldn’t be. I would probably say like eight to ten thousand dollars a month.

[00:34:09] CHRIS: You’re making six figures a year or just under it. For texting on your phone and hanging out with one of them and touching his hair. Kudos to you. Kudos to you my, friend.

[00:34:26] CALLER: I mean, it’s not like I’m living lavishly or anything. Like I still shop at, like, WinnCo and like, try to live. I mean, like, I’m paying off student loans. I’m helping my family. You know, it’s not like I’m bored over here like buying Louis Vuittons or whatever it is kids do nowadays.

[00:34:48] CHRIS: You’re not popping bottles in the club, making it rain.

[00:34:51] CALLER: Oh, God, no. I can’t even really drink that much. I’m so boring.

[00:34:55] CHRIS: Is this income… Do you pay taxes on it? Or is this all under the table?

[00:35:02] CALLER: I mean I should… I think I should be. And I’m really hoping I never get audited.

[00:35:09] CHRIS: You got to launder this? You gotta pretend you own a car wash? Like Walter White? Buy a car wash.

[00:35:16] CALLER: I use cash apps and I try to spread it out. So like with Pay Pal, if you get more than twenty five hundred a year through Pay Pal they automatically report it to the IRS and you have to send them like information for it. So I use Pay Pal for two of my Skype clients. Because their revenue doesn’t get anywhere near that.

[00:35:44] CHRIS: Right.

[00:35:44] CALLER: And for Bear, we use the cash app because it’s instant and he’s like my ATM.

[00:35:54] CHRIS:Okay, speaking of Bear, you referred to him as a little queer bear. Does this mean… Do you mean… Because that is a phrase, calling someone a bear, means someone who’s a little bit larger. and hairier in the gay world. Do you mean he’s a queer bear in that sense? Or is he a straight man that you just have nicknamed?

[00:36:09] CALLER: Yeah.

[00:36:10] CHRIS: This is a homosexual male?

[00:36:14] CALLER: Well, he’s bisexual. Like I said, he has a girlfriend.

[00:36:17] CHRIS: Okay. Okay.

[00:36:18] CALLER: But he’s very very queer.

[00:36:21] CHRIS: You live in a very specific fringe of the world. I like hearing about it.

[00:36:29] CALLER: And like, literally you would never guess. Like if you saw me walking down the street, you wouldn’t think that I… I mean, like, I don’t think that I dress lavishly or anything, because I wasn’t really raised like that. Like I was raised, you know, I wouldn’t say like incredibly poor, but I mean, it’s not like we were able to go on vacations all the time. And, you know, my parents would fight about money a lot, and especially after my parents got divorced, like I had to get another underground job when I was like 14 to help take care of my siblings because my dad was out of the picture and my mom was like, sleep all day and then be out for days at a time partying.

[00:37:13] CHRIS: Wow. When you say underground job… What does that mean?

[00:37:18] CALLER: I realize that sounds a little like… It’s just, I don’t like throwing… I mean, I used to help my friend deal drugs. Because my mom wouldn’t like… Basically the money she got from my dad during the divorce she wouldn’t use for us. So I had to like, you know, feed my little brother and my little sister.

[00:37:39] CHRIS: Wow. So you’ve always been a scrapper.

[00:37:43] CALLER: Yeah. I mean, you have to when you’re in that situation, you know what I mean? I mean, like the…But then sex work was because I was unemployed, like I needed something.

[00:37:56] CHRIS: Wow. Do you find the sex work takes a toll? Emotionally or on your own romantic life or in any way?

[00:38:13] CALLER: Yeah. I mean, it can get… I mean, like it was definitely more exhausting like when I started, because I just I wasn’t used to like the volume. Like it really is like feeling overwhelmed. Like, you know, can you… I’m sure people are out there that are listening that post on here. Like, when you post you get hundreds of messages. Like, hundreds. And sometimes they’re really fucked up and that’s coming from somebody that has seen fucked up messages.

[00:38:48] CHRIS: These are the messages you get on Reddit?

[00:38:52] CALLER: Huh?

[00:38:53] CHRIS: Are these the messages you get on Reddit?

[00:38:56] CALLER: Yeah. Yeah, that’s usually how I pick up clients.

[00:39:00] CHRIS: So you post a picture on Reddit, hundreds of messages come in. What type of fucked up stuff are we talking?

[00:39:05] CALLER: Oh, God. Here, let me go through my messages. One second. Let me see if I can… I mean, like even if they’re not fucked up, like, you know, like I’m just looking at it right now, like scrolling through. Like seeing “If I fly out to see you can we fuck?” “Oh, well hello there gorgeous. What’s your opinion on taking men?” “I just have to let you know, you look so sexy.” “Which Pokemon is it?” That I have a Pokemon necklace. You know, like… Just tons of things. Like, “Do you accept offers to cheer you up from lonely men?” Like, I mean if cheering up means money then sure. God, there was this one. I can’t remember, like obviously verbatim what it was, but basically it was like probably like a five paragraph message outlining this like very detailed, like rape fantasy that this guy had.

[00:40:04] CHRIS: Oh, geez.

[00:40:07] CALLER: Yeah. Which was pretty alarming.

[00:40:09] CHRIS: Oh boy.

[00:40:13] CALLER: That was very, very startling. Especially since I’m like, you know, I’m a survivor of sexual assault. So that will definitely not be something I don’t think you could pay me enough to do.

[00:40:25] CHRIS: Yeah, that seems like one to avoid. That seems like one to avoid.

[00:40:29] CALLER: I usually tend to report those people.

[00:40:32] CHRIS: Yeah. Yeah, that’s good.

[00:40:35] CALLER: But when I do get those messages, I also tend to suggest to the person to seek help. Like to seek some sort of psychiatric help.

[00:40:45] CHRIS: Right.

[00:40:46] CALLER: I don’t just ignore them, you know. I’ll say like, “I’m not really into this. If this is something you’re seriously considering acting out, I would suggest going to professional psychiatrist, discuss best ways you can do this. What’s causing you to think this? If it’s truly just something you want and not something you’re actually intending to do, then cool. You’ll find somebody.” But. I don’t do those.

[00:41:12] CHRIS: Yeah. So do you date?

[00:41:16] CALLER: Do you know who Dan Savage is?

[00:41:17] CHRIS: Yeah, I know who Dan Savage is.

[00:41:19] CALLER: Yeah. So he likes to call those ravishment… They’re like. I think they’re ravishment fantasies. You know, so like you can kind of tell the difference between like rape fantasies and ravishment fantasies, if that makes sense.

[00:41:34] CHRIS: Mhm.

[00:41:37] CALLER: And to answer your question, yeah, I actually have a partner. We’ve been together for two and a half years. This will be our third year.

[00:41:45] CHRIS: And your partner, I would imagine, you seem so open, your partner is well aware of your side gig. How do they feel about it?

[00:41:53] CALLER: Yeah. He’s actually the one that encouraged me to post on Reddit the first time.

[00:41:57] CHRIS: Oh yeah, you mentioned that. You mentioned that.

[00:42:00] CALLER: Yeah, so he is totally happy about it. Like, I mean, he’s great. He’s honestly like… Anytime I… you know, cause like we’re in an open relationship, so we always check in with each other before we do anything. You know, even with like my sex work. And he’s always of the mindset, like, do whatever makes you happy. You know?

[00:42:24] CHRIS: Wow.

[00:42:25] CALLER: Which is nice.

[00:42:27] CHRIS: Wow.

[00:42:29] CALLER: You don’t have a partner telling you to do what makes you happy then maybe you should reconsider your relationship.

[00:42:35] CHRIS: Right. Of course.

[00:42:36] CALLER: I mean, unless doing what makes you happy is like harming other people. Definitely don’t do that.

[00:42:40] CHRIS: Or hurting them. At which point you gotta have a discussion about that.

[00:42:45] CALLER: Exactly. Everything with emotional intelligence.

[00:42:49] CHRIS: Now you’re studying political science. What is it that you want to accomplish in the world of politics?

[00:42:55] CALLER: Well, I mean, such a big question. I mean, I’d like to get… I mean, okay. In a perfect world, I would become president and bitch slap this country into shape. But I don’t think that makes for a very good slogan.

[00:43:11] CHRIS: I think that’s a great slogan. Great slogan.

[00:43:15] CALLER: I think… I think I could probably get away with it.

[00:43:19] CHRIS: Who would you’re running mate… Who’s the ideal running mate? If you run for president with the slogan “I’m gonna  bitch slap this country into shape,” who’s your ideal running mate?

[00:43:27] CALLER: Aw, man. You know, I feel like this is maybe a little bit… Maybe I would change my mind, but I really dig Cardi B right now. I think maybe she would be my VP.

[00:43:40] CHRIS: Cardi B?I though you were gonna say like Cory Booker.

[00:43:46] CALLER: No, I don’t. I mean, unless I came in with somebody that maybe was, you know, like in line with what I was wanting to do. Sure. But I mean…

[00:43:58] CHRIS: I thought you were gonna say Tammy Duckworth.

[00:43:59] CALLER: If we’re going with like, famous people, I’d totally pick Cardi B.

[00:44:01] CHRIS: Cardi B. Let’s bitch slap this country in to place. Wow.

[00:44:07] CALLER: Yep.

[00:44:09] CHRIS: Wow.

[00:44:10] CALLER: She would just stand there and go, “Okurrr!”

[00:44:13] CHRIS: Now, can I ask how old you are? Is that is that inappropriate? You don’t have to share. But can I ask how old you are?

[00:44:17] CALLER: Oh, no. Yeah, I am 23.

[00:44:20] CHRIS: 23. Wow, you’ve lived a lot for 23.

[00:44:25] CALLER: Yeah. I can’t believe people expect me to do this for another 60 years.

[00:44:32] CHRIS: Do what? Just in general, stay alive?

[00:44:35] CALLER: Yeah, just in general, stay alive. Thank God I’m on Zoloft.

[00:44:40] CHRIS: I’m on Lamictal and Welbutrin over here. I tell you, I was walking down the street yesterday. I’m about to turn 38 next month and I was walking down the street running… I was like running late to the Comedy Cellar, stressed about when we get there on time. Got off the subway and I was like in my head… Pops into my head, I’m like you you’re like probably maybe halfway through life. You have to double this bullshit.

[00:45:06] CALLER: Oh, my god.

[00:45:07] CHRIS: I tell you, I sometimes…

[00:45:08] CALLER: And you’re just like, “Why?”

[00:45:09] CHRIS: I know I sometimes sit around and get actually mad that modern medicine has expanded the human lifespan so much. I’m like, I’m turning 38. I should be a great grandfather on my deathbed biologically.

[00:45:21] CALLER: Right. People should be like respecting you and your opinion. As an elder.

[00:45:26] CHRIS: I would love to see that day come. Love to see that day come. My opinions get respected, someday that’ll happen. Someday that’ll happen.

[00:45:35] CALLER: Elder Gethard.

[00:45:36] CHRIS: Oh, boy, that’ll be the day. That’ll be the day. Human life span…

[00:45:41] CALLER: At least I have a good retirement plan.

[00:45:42] CHRIS: Yeah? What’s your retirement plan?

[00:45:46] CALLER: It’s actually the only part of my life that I actually have planned out in some detail. When I turn 64, I’m going to sing the Beatles song. That’s like one of the reasons I never committed suicide because I have to turn 64 and sing that song. That’s my one goal. But after I turn 64, I’m going to retire to Canada and get a fleet of Russian bear dogs and raise them on a farm. And then when America dissolves into its next civil war, I’m gonna ride into battle with my fleet of Russian bear dogs and take over.

[00:46:30] CHRIS: What are you talking about?

[00:46:33] [AD BREAK]

[00:48:43] CALLER: Don’t tell me that that isn’t the greatest plan ever.

[00:48:47] CHRIS: What are Russian bear dogs and why are you gonna build an army of them? What are you talking about?

[00:48:52] CALLER: Because they’re fucking cute. They’re so cute. Google it. You have a computer, right? Google Russian bear dogs. They are so cute. They’re big fluffy dogs. And so, like, I’m a tiny person. I’m like 5’2″ and weigh about like 100 pounds. I could ride a Russian bear dog easily.

[00:49:12] CHRIS: Yeah, these dogs are huge. I’m looking them up now. These dogs are huge. You weren’t kidding.

[00:49:17] CALLER: Yeah. I mean, you could probably ride one.

[00:49:19] CHRIS: So you’re gonna… You’re gonna go… Okay… Does this take a minute…

[00:49:27] CALLER: You can come visit my farm of Russian bear dogs.

[00:49:30] CHRIS: In 40 years. In 40 years, I’ll be 78 years old. Come visit your farm of Russian bear dogs.

[00:49:35] CALLER: Yeah, you’ll still be young. You’ll still be getting pissed off about having to go through another 10 years.

[00:49:40] CHRIS: Yeah. Why did they invent penicillin? Whoever invented penicillin is a monster. No, penicillin is saving many, many lives.

[00:49:52] CALLER: You know who else is a monster?

[00:49:53] CHRIS: Who’s that?

[00:49:54] CALLER: The person that invented microwaves. Why did you let me have a thing that can enable me to eat such shitty food?

[00:50:03] CHRIS: Yeah, the penicillin and microwave industry has dominated American life for far too long. Now, before I hear about it, before people start tweeting at me, let me just say penicillin has saved many, many lives. I’m aware of that. I was making jokes. I am a comedian. Of course, I don’t think that penicillin is a bad thing.

[00:50:18] CALLER: Microwaves have also saved lots of lives.

[00:50:20] CHRIS: Yeah, I mean, without microwaves you got no Hot Pockets. Who wants to live in a world without Hot Pockets?

[00:50:29] CALLER: I think anybody that’s ever eaten a Hot Pocket and had it ravage their stomach, but probably agree with it.

[00:50:35] CHRIS: So you just cost me one potential advertiser. Looks like Hot Pockets is never gonna get on board. Oh, Beautiful Anonymous, order Hot Pockets today! Promo code is…

[00:50:49] CALLER: Promo code is Sex Work 420.

[00:50:50] CHRIS: Yeah. Promo code is Tiny Tits.

[00:50:57] CALLER: Oh, my God.

[00:50:58] CHRIS: Now, is this something you plan on riding out? Because you’re 23 years old? I mean, this is something that could last a while in your life. Or are you looking for an exit strategy on this?

[00:51:08] CALLER: I mean, I can pretty much end it whenever I want. You know, like I’m not, like, contractually obligated to any of these people, although I’ve had people ask if I would ever sign a contract with them. Which, no thanks.

[00:51:22] CHRIS: What’s that like a non-disclosure type thing?

[00:51:24] CALLER: Yeah. Or like I’ve had a couple people like want to like basically have me be a live in with them, but I would have to find sort of like… Sort of like an NDA.

[00:51:38] CHRIS: Woah.

[00:51:39] CALLER: Which I’m not about.

[00:51:40] CHRIS: But you’ll go like get a room in some rich person’s house. And they’ll have you there. And you’ll be like an employee of some weird LLC. That’s just a bunch of numbers and letters.

[00:51:52] CALLER: Yeah, exactly. Just somewhere in like the Maldives or whatever. That would actually be kind of cool. If anybody wants to take me to the Maldives…

[00:52:01] CHRIS: Is it “Mal-deevs?” I think it’s “Mal-deevs.” Can we look up the pronunciation on that, please? “Mal-deevs?”

[00:52:06] CALLER: Okay, you know what? I’ve always said “Mal-dee-vays.”

[00:52:09] CHRIS: What’s that?

[00:52:09] CALLER: I’ve always said “mal-dee-vays” And I’ve had so many friends say “Mal-dives.”

[00:52:14] CHRIS: “Mal-dives.” I don’t know, I could be wrong.

[00:52:15] CALLER: But I never felt like that was right.

[00:52:18] CHRIS: Is that the one off the coast of Sri Lanka? Where I just was?

[00:52:21] CALLER: Ah, Sri Lanka would be great, too. Sri Lanka is beautiful.

[00:52:24] CHRIS: Oh, my God. It was the best. We’ve got three people in this room all separately looking up how to pronounce…

[00:52:29] COMPUTER: “Mal-dives.”

[00:52:30] CHRIS: “Mal-dives.” Thank you. Someone just played the…

[00:52:37] CALLER: Was I right?

[00:52:38] CHRIS: You were. Could you hear that? I don’t know if that was Jared or Harry that… Jared got his computer to say the word Maldives. “Mal-dives.”

[00:52:47] CALLER: So it is “Mal-dives.”

[00:52:48] CHRIS: I think it is the one off the coast of Sri Lanka where I just was.

[00:52:52] CALLER: That’s such a boring, Americanized way to pronounce such a beautiful place. Maybe that’s just me, but that’s just like “Mal-dives.” Like. I don’t know, it’s like a shitty dove bar somewhere.

[00:53:07] CHRIS: Can I ask you a hard question?

[00:53:10] CALLER: Sure.

[00:53:11] CHRIS: You mention parents brought some drama into your life. Mentioned that you had to, you know, help your your siblings survive. Mentioned that you dealt drugs to do that. Now you’re in sex work. An interesting layer of sex work, not what everybody thinks of when they think of sex work. Something that sounds like at the very least, it’s not the most… At the very least, not the most physically risky type of sex work.

[00:53:40] CALLER: Yeah, which is why I like it.

[00:53:42] CHRIS: Yeah. And I mean, there’s definite other types out there. But do you consider your participation in sex work an extension of the hard aspects of your life, or is it separate in your mind?

[00:53:57] CALLER: I mean, that’s like the question. You know, a lot of people assume that people that get into sex work have been victims of sexual assault or abuse. Which I mean, a lot of that is true. But I think you would be hard pressed to find any industry that doesn’t have people that were subjected to sexual abuse. You know what I mean? So I think maybe on some level I just am more accustomed to being in industries that you sort of have to struggle to be in. But I’ve also always been a very independent person. You know, like my parents used to make fun of me because like, you know, like my little brother was a mama’s boy. My little sister was a daddy’s girl. And I could have given a shit about either of them. So I’ve always been pretty independent. And I think being… I don’t like being told what to do, when to do it. Having an office job is very difficult for somebody like me. I do not have an office personality.

[00:55:03] CHRIS: Do you consider yourself a happy person?

[00:55:08] CALLER: I think I’m definitely getting there. I’m a lot happier now than I was five years ago. I would definitely say that. I don’t know. I mean, is anybody really happy? I don’t know. I think having depression is sort of like… I don’t know, it kind of skews how you view happiness, like to me, happiness is not being depressed, you know?

[00:55:40] CHRIS: Right.

[00:55:41] CALLER: Like, I don’t know if that makes sense.

[00:55:43] CHRIS: Hitting a neutral point. Hitting a neutral point where your head is clear is a good place to be.

[00:55:50] CALLER: Yeah, but I mean, I have been pretty happy recently. Like so my partner and I have been together for a couple of years now and he finally told me he loves me, which, fucking finally. So that was really nice. That’s made me real happy lately. Kept me going a little bit. It’s real difficult.

[00:56:12] CHRIS: You and I haven’t been saying “Sorry Sally” after we curse, but that’s for anybody listening…

[00:56:16] CALLER: Oh, no! I told myself I would apologize to your mom. Aw, Sally, I’m so sorry. It’s gonna keep happening.

[00:56:25] CHRIS: I was just going to say though, we don’t have to apologize because she turned this one off a while ago. She turned this one off as soon as she heard sex work. She went “Click.” As soon as you were like, “I’m a sex worker.” I was like, “That’s cool”. She was like, “I don’t want to know what my son thinks about this.”

[00:56:40] CALLER: No. But mom, I could give you so many tips.

[00:56:43] CHRIS: Oh, okay. Let’s watch it. Let’s watch it.

[00:56:47] CALLER: Not sex tips. I mean, obviously, she didn’t need any help with that. You’re here.

[00:56:52] CHRIS: Okay. Okay. Okay. Let’s everybody take a deep breath…

[00:56:56] CALLER: Alright, I’ll dial it back. I’m sorry. You’re gonna start yelling at me. Oh, God.

[00:57:05] CHRIS: What would you say… I gotta ask. Cause you seem so well-adjusted in conversation, but you’ve described a lot of hard stuff and you’ve also described the life now that is technically still outside the law. Right? Maybe? I don’t know. Is it?

[00:57:24] CALLER: Yeah, it definitely is like doing escort stuff. That’s definitely not legal. And cam work is sort of a gray area.

[00:57:35] CHRIS: What would you say… What would you say is the thing that defines you the most? Or has defined you the most? Because you mentioned so much.

[00:57:49] CALLER: That’s such a hard question. I think… Honestly, I think the thing that like has sort of defined me the most is… Honestly, I think… Do you know what I.B. is? The International Baccalaureate program?

[00:58:11] CHRIS: Did not see this coming. Did not see this answer coming. Now fill me in on the International Baccalaureate program. Did I pronounce that right?

[00:58:20] CALLER: Yeah. So basically, it’s a two year program for high school students. They do it their junior and senior year. And so, you know, you have like regular high school classes, early college classes, AP classes and then I.B. is like way up there. So I did this program in high school and it was probably the hardest thing that I’ve ever done. College is a fucking breeze compared to I.B. And it destroyed my psyche when I graduated. Like, it fucking ruined me. Like there’s a month of testing that you have to do at the end of it that covers all two years of your study. And I basically like lived on a blanket in my living room for a month, like preparing and doing these tests. And you know, on top of going through a divorce, which really ended up lasting five years.

[00:59:22] CHRIS: So your parents divorce?

[00:59:23] CALLER: You know? My parents are divorced, yeah.

[00:59:27] CHRIS: And that’s… So, not you. You weren’t divorced.

[00:59:30] CALLER: No, not me. Jesus Christ. I would never. Oh, my God. First of all, I would never get married. And if I did get married, that bitch is signing a prenup. Dead ass, never dealing with that.

[00:59:43] CHRIS: Just to make sure I heard right. You did just see the phrase “That bitch is getting a prenup.” That is what I heard.

[00:59:49] CALLER: Yes.

[00:59:50] CHRIS: Okay. Okay. Just making sure that I heard the phrase “That bitch is getting a prenup.” Just making sure.

[00:59:59] CALLER: I mean, I work in a law firm. I have to know what that is.

[01:00:05] CHRIS: So, school…

[01:00:06] CALLER: But yeah, I think…

[01:00:07] CHRIS: Not the divorce, not being a survivor of sexual assault, school. School is what fucked you up the most?

[01:00:14] CALLER: Yeah. I mean, I would say I think sexual assault has certainly shaped me into who I am today, but not for reasons that I think people would think. It’s not that it… I mean, it is traumatizing and it is something that I still work through. You know, I still get panic attacks sometimes when something triggers me a little bit. But I think what it did for me was get me interested in feminism. Like so the day after I was first assaulted when I was 15, we had sex ed class that day and apparently we were doing a rape prevention class. And my teacher was like a 50 year old white dude from Texas. Who should not have been teaching sex ed. And he started the class by saying, “Let’s say you’re running late to school. You get in your car, you start your car and you realize you forgot your backpack in your house. You leave your keys in your car. You go back into your house to get your backpack and you come back out and your car’s gone. Whose fault is it?”. And everybody in the class was like, “The asshole that stole your car.” And he was like, “No, you know, you have a responsibility to keep yourself safe.” And then he pauses and goes, “Rape is kind of like that.”

[01:01:37] CHRIS: Oh, geez.

[01:01:38] CALLER: And as… You know, and I didn’t know anything about rape culture, about victim blame, but something in me knew that that wasn’t right. Like as guilty as I felt in that moment and as disgusting as I felt in that moment, I knew it wasn’t me. But I didn’t know why. You know what I mean? And so I started researching and I got really interested in feminism and feminist theory and, you know, sort of went through the typical things that, you know, people go through when they learn about a huge oppressive system. You know, you get angry. You want to learn more. And so I think maybe that did change who I am in a lot of ways and sort of started me on a lifelong passion of feminism and advocacy. But I think ultimately it was… I think what shapes my life now is trying to put the pieces back together after a really grueling educational experience, especially going through college at the same time. You know what I mean?

[01:02:52] CHRIS: I never liked school myself either.

[01:01:56] CALLER: Oh, my God. Don’t do it. Don’t do it.

[01:02:59] CHRIS: No.

[01:03:00] CALLER: It’s not worth it.

[01:03:01] CHRIS: And my mom’s gonna kill me if this comes up again.

[01:03:04] CALLER: I’m sorry, Mom,

[01:03:06] CHRIS: But it sounds like it served you well. Like you’re working in a law firm. You’re still going to school, it sounds like. Right? Political science? Still studying it?

[01:03:13] CALLER: Yep! It’s my last term. Graduate in June.

[01:03:17] CHRIS: That’s with your bachelors degree? Yeah. Bachelor of Arts because I don’t want to do math.

[01:03:25] CHRIS: Yeah, screw math. Math is no bueno. So you’re at work right now?

[01:03:32] CALLER: Yeah, my lunch break. I decided to take my lunch super early.

[01:03:37] CHRIS: How’s your coworkers migraine doing?

[01:03:40] CALLER: You know, I haven’t asked. I should message him and see how he’s doing. I love making fun of him. I’ll ask how he’s doing. Yeah, I am at work right now. Actually, how much longer on our call do we have?

[01:04:01] CHRIS: About five minutes. But if you got to go, you could be the second hang up in history.

[01:04:06] CALLER: Nah, I do what I want.

[01:04:08] CHRIS: Yeah. Yeah, I get that impression. I get that impression.

[01:04:13] CALLER: I’m the office assistant. I’m not doing anything crazy right now.

[01:04:16] CHRIS: Now wait. Are the days where you’re texting Papi all day and he’s coming on strong and it’s emotionally exhausting. And then you get home and your partner needs some attention and you just don’t have it left in you?

[01:04:30] CALLER: No, I don’t think so, at least not with my partner. Like he is very like low key. Like, I think if we didn’t live together and if I didn’t talk to him all the time, we would probably like never talk or see each other. He would be like perfectly content to just stay at home on his video games all day.

[01:04:53] CHRIS: All right.

[01:04:55] CALLER: So he’s real easy, I’m the like, the high maintenance one in our relationship. I’m like, can we hang out 24/7? Like, I don’t even want to do anything. I just want to sit next to you.

[01:05:06] CHRIS: That’s nice. You just sit next to me while he plays video games?

[01:05:11] CALLER: Yeah. Just sit there messaging all of my clients.

[01:05:15] CHRIS: So there’s nights you have where he’ll be playing video games and you’ll be on the couch with your feet up on his lap. He’s holding the controller high. And you’re texting a mysterious millionaire you only know as Papi who’s telling you about all of his sexual fantasies towards you. And then you occasionally text him a naked picture. That’s a thing that happens in your life on a semi-regular basis?

[01:05:37] CALLER: Yeah, sometimes [beep] helps me figure out like things to say.

[01:05:41] CHRIS: We’re going to bleep…

[01:05:42] CALLER: Oh, no! I said his name.

[01:05:43] CHRIS: We’re gonna bleep the partner’s name. So Papi doesn’t know this, but there’s sometimes where your partner is like, “Tell Papi…”; “Papi would like it if you said this.” that your partner is sometimes giving you that perspective of like, you know, tell Papi…

[01:05:56] CALLER: Yeah.

[01:05:57] CHRIS: “Tell Papi you’re gonna step on his nuts.”

[01:06:01] CALLER: Yeah. Oh, my God. He’s such a weirdo. Papi is definitely the weirdest client I’ve ever had. I wish I could tell you more stories of him.

[01:06:10] CHRIS: Papi likes pain. Every once in a while, your partners like, “Tell Papi you’re gonna make them wear a dog leash and drag them around on the floor. If he tries to prop himself up on his hands and knees, you’re gonna put your high heel in the side of his neck.

[01:06:24] CALLER: Oh, my God. Do you want to hear kind of a gross story?

[01:06:27] CHRIS: Yes. Yes.

[01:06:30] CALLER: Okay. Okay. I figured. I just wanted to make sure. Consent is important.

[01:06:34] CHRIS: Thank you so much. You’re teaching me. You’re teaching me. Teaching moment. Learning moment.

[01:06:41] CALLER: Part of what got Papi and I started is he really likes these boots I used to wear. They’re like, super gross. Like they had like holes in the toes and the heels were all run down and broken. Like I could never wear them when it rained because my feet would just get soaked. He loved these things. I don’t know why he was like in love with these shoes. And so he paid me to mail them to him. And then as soon as he got them, he called me. He was like, “What do you want me to do with them?” And I was like, “Well, what do you want to ask me to do with them?”

[01:07:22] CHRIS: Right. Let’s step outside of the fence a minute and give me some guidance here, Papi.

[01:07:28] CALLER: Yeah, exactly. He wanted to lick them clean.

[01:07:34] CHRIS: Whoa.

[01:07:35] CALLER: So I told him I gave him permission. And he cleaned those shoes. Probably better than they had been cleaned since I saw them. Like on the on the shelf.

I did not do a video for that because I was gagging so bad. Oh, my God. It was so bad.

[01:08:01] CHRIS: But then do you have to write…

[01:08:02] CALLER: I had to take a Zofran so I didn’t throw up.

[01:08:06] CHRIS: You’re fighting back vomit. But then you have to write him and say, like, “That turns me on, you pig.”

[01:08:12] CALLER: Yeah, well, I had my voice on. So like, I’m like muting every time I’m gagging and then coming back on and encouraging him.

[01:08:22] CHRIS: Like, “Lick those boots clean you slave.” And then you put it on mute, you’re like, “Bleghh” And you come back on and you’re like, “Crawl!”

[01:08:29] CALLER: That’s literally what it was.

[01:08:31] CHRIS: And then you get back on and you’re like, “Crawl on your hands and knees, you pig. You’re my money pig.”

[01:08:36] CALLER: Get back on and I’m like, “You missed a spot you fat sick sack of shit. Like, what are you doing? That’s disrespectful.”

[01:08:44] CHRIS: And he’s like licking a boot while he’s rolling around on the ground, playing with himself? Like, that’s the type of thing?

[01:08:49] CALLER: Yeah.

[01:08:51] CHRIS: Wow. I was complaining at the beginning of this call because my gig is TV show host. I was complaining about being a TV show host at the top of this call.

[01:09:01] CALLER: Hey, I mean, every job comes with stress. It’s not a competition.

[01:09:06] CHRIS: You’re like, “You worthless sack of shit. You clean the part where my feet touched!. You get in that boot! You get your weak little tongue all the way in that boot! Lick it clean!

[01:09:15] CALLER: I’m so surprised that he didn’t go to the hospital. Those shoes were disgusting.

[01:09:21] CHRIS: We have about 10 seconds left. What a beautiful story to end on. Thank you for all your insight and openness.

[01:09:31] CALLER: Yeah. Have a great day. Good luck with work. Thanks for talking.

[01:09:36] CHRIS: Thank you. [ring] Caller, Thank you so much. What an eye opening experience, especially that boot stuff at the end. That was very illuminating. Thanks for walking us through your world and I hope everything’s good. Hope everything’s good with you. Thank you for calling. Thank you for everybody who listens to the show, it really means a lot. Thank you to Harry Nelson, Jared O’Connell, who walked all the way here in the warm sun. Slogged it over here in the warm sun, set up in my office. Means a lot. Thanks John Delore and Gretta Cohn for helping to build the show. Thank you Shellshag for the intro music. Chrisgeth.com. That’s where my touring dates are. I got a lot of stand up dates up there right now. Check it out. See if any of them are in your town. They just might be. I got like eight or nine cities up there right now. Anywho, it’s if you want to help the show, Apple Podcasts. Rate, review, subscribe. It really does help more than you know. That’s all the business. We’ll see you next time on Beautiful Anonymous.

[01:10:49] [AD BREAK]

[NEXT EPISODE PREVIEW]

[01:11:37] CHRIS: Have you worked on cases with people where, you know, you think you have a chance of helping and then they are put to death?

[01:11:46] CALLER: Yeah. Although I’ll say this, I have been incredibly lucky as a lawyer working in this field and the 99 percent of cases I have been a part of, that I have touched, that I have become emotionally attached to and invested, have avoided execution. Some of them very last minute.

[01:12:12] CHRIS: That’s next time on Beautiful Anonymous.