December 19, 2022
What’s Kim Kardashian like? A 25-year-old shares wild stories about living and working in a boujee Colorado ski town teaching wealthy people (including Kim and Kanye) how to ski. She opens up about being the daughter of diplomats wondering if she’ll move to Europe to be closer to her parents. She describes moving between worlds hanging out with billionaires by day and “dirtbag hippies” by night. She also explains why her father feels safer in Europe than he does in the U.S. as a black person.
350 — Boujee Dirtbag
Chris [00:00:05] Hello to everybody who’s just waiting for their billionaire. It’s Beautiful/ Anonymous. One hour. One phone call. No names. No holds barred… Hi everybody. Chris Gethard here. Welcome to another episode of Beautiful/ Anonymous. Closing out the year strong. I’m telling you, man, we have been on a hot streak with calls this year. And it continues. Simple as that. This one is is a very fascinating call that I’ve been thinking about since we recorded it. I want to let you know that there’s always shows coming up, but who cares, right? I don’t have anything for January. I’ll be in Georgia, couple cities in Georgia, Athens and Atlanta. Go to ChrisGeth.com. But I’m not going to sit here and talk about that the whole time. For now we’re gonna just chill out. Everybody chill out. We’re gonna do the thing. This week’s call is really just a fascinating look at a life. I keep thinking about this caller because she just walks in between worlds. It comes up in so many ways. I think you’ll see how it applies. She is someone who is raised by diplomats. It’s just a look at a person who’s figuring it out as we all are. But in the process of figuring it out, is living a life that is undeniably fascinating. And also, if we want to just go ahead and say some things that might get the algorithm, also just like running into Kim and Kanye, because that happens in this caller’s life, too. It’s a really interesting caller with an interesting life tale. Enjoy the call.
Voicemail Robot [00:01:54] Thank you for calling Beautiful/ Anonymous. A beeping noise will indicate when you are on the show with the host.
Chris [00:02:02] Hello?
Caller [00:02:04] Hello?
Chris [00:02:06] Hi.
Caller [00:02:07] Is this Chris?
Chris [00:02:09] Yeah. Yeah. How are you?
Caller [00:02:11] Hi. I’m good. How are you?
Chris [00:02:14] Pretty good. Yeah, that’s the answer. Pretty good. How are you?
Caller [00:02:19] I’m good. I am a little bit tired because I am very, very jetlagged right now. Um, I’m calling you from France, so I’m pretty tired, but otherwise, I’m good. I’m here visiting my family, so I can’t complain about that.
Chris [00:02:39] Okay, I’m going to say a couple of things. First off. I like your vibe. Just out of the gate. I’m getting a good sense of the vibe in general. Second of all, is your family in France for the holiday, or are you is your background French?
Caller [00:02:59] Neither. Um I my family is well, mostly well, American and Canadian. And they live in Switzerland. And I’m visiting, I guess, for the holidays, even though it wasn’t really for that. And my parents just bought their retirement home in France. So I’m here visiting for the first time.
Chris [00:03:25] Wow. Good for them.
Caller [00:03:27] So yeah, so they’re kind of living their best lives right now. But yeah, so I’m here visiting and then we’ll head back to the States where I actually live in about a week or two. Yeah, whenever I feel like it.
Chris [00:03:46] When you say we’ll head back to the States, who’s we?
Caller [00:03:49] Oh, I will head back to the States.
Chris [00:03:51] You will. Got it. Got it.
Caller [00:03:55] Just me. I’m solo. Yeah.
Chris [00:03:59] Well, I’m sorry you’re tired, but it’s pretty cool you’re in France.
Caller [00:04:03] It’s great. I can’t complain. I’ve, I’ve also done this trip many, many times before, so I’m pretty used to it. But, yeah, we’re rocking it. We just got home, and it’s like this amazing village that they live in with this castle from the 10th century. Anyway, it’s, it’s cool stuff. So, yeah, I’m just kind of enjoying being in a place that has, like, a little bit more history than the U.S. sometimes.
Chris [00:04:36] That’s, that’s all right. Yeah, I like it. It is amazing, as an American, I just have to encourage any of my fellow Americans who haven’t traveled to places older than America. You got to do it. And I’ve said on this show before.
Caller [00:04:50] Yeah.
Chris [00:04:51] I used to be scared of international travel. It used to make me so nervous. And then half out of career necessity, half because my wife loves traveling, started doing it more, and you realize, Oh, America’s like 5 minutes old by world standards. It’s like 5 minutes old.
Caller [00:05:11] Yeah. No, it’s so true.
Chris [00:05:11] You’re talking about stuff from the 10th century and we have, like, mini malls with Panera Breads. You know?
Caller [00:05:18] Yeah. No, I. Yeah, I feel like I’ve heard you talk about your experiences being in Edinburgh and being at, like, gyms in ancient buildings and stuff, and that just like, rings so true. It’s like everything is like the newest stuff over here is as old as the U.S. is. So yeah, it’s pretty epic to be able to sort of take a trip through time a little bit.
Chris [00:05:44] Indeed. And I just want to say this. We’re 5 minutes in. I’m happy to chit chat about France and international travel, if that’s what you’d like this to be. So I’m not sure if there’s something you want to talk about or if you want to just talk more about France.
Caller [00:06:00] Well, we can do either. But yeah, I grew up in in Switzerland, um, in like a diplomatic family and pretty, you know, international and bougie. And now I live up in the mountains in Colorado out west, and I ski for a living and mountain guide and bike all day and have a ton of fun. And I live- I won’t say where I live because it’s really tiny, but I live in one of these pretty swanky resorts and have all these crazy clients who come visit. And so I think I mentioned in the voicemail I spent a weekend hanging out with Kim Kardashian and Kanye West and their families, which was super weird. So, yeah, I’ve kind of had this like total 180 from my origins a little bit, which is another which is a silly story in and of itself.
Chris [00:07:04] Well, that’s fascinating to me because I have to- I’ll say on my end to hear that you grew up in Switzerland and now you live in a ski resort, that actually doesn’t sound like a180. It sounds like sounds like it tracks.
Caller [00:07:17] Fair enough. I guess I keep gravitating to altitude, generally.
Chris [00:07:23] It seems like snow and altitude is kind of your jam.
Caller [00:07:27] It’s I guess it is, honestly. Which is like funny because when I was a kid, I was the antithesis of all of that, though. Like I was the kid who, like, didn’t want to go outside and didn’t want to sweat or get dirty or touch bugs. And now I’d say I spend at least half the year sleeping on a sleeping bag outside in the woods. Um, and I’m a little bit of a dirt bag. So that part, I guess, is a bit of a 180.
Chris [00:07:59] I got to ask, when you say you ski professionally, how’s that? How do you mean? Because I don’t get the sense there’s too many professional skier jobs.
Caller [00:08:09] No, there aren’t. I, well, I, I’m not like a- I’m, I’m like a low level… Low level in that world. And I like teach and guide skiing. So I basically just get paid all day to ski with really cool clients and explore the mountains. Yeah. So I started off by just like ski instructing at a resort and kind of went from there. But I yeah, I teach all kinds of people how to ski and I guide and do some stuff on the resort and backcountry skiing. So just spend a lot of time in the mountains, really.
Chris [00:08:54] Next question.
Caller [00:08:56] Okay.
Chris [00:08:57] Is Kim Kardashian nice?
Caller [00:09:02] She’s fine. That’s what I would say.
Chris [00:09:06] I love that answer.
Caller [00:09:07] She’s not nice but she’s also not mean. She was exactly like everything that you see on TV is exactly how they are in real life. It was actually hilarious to witness, but.
Chris [00:09:22] Oh wow.
Caller [00:09:23] Mostly notable was just that they have like the attention spans of goldfish.
Chris [00:09:29] With all the social media and whatnot.
Caller [00:09:31] I guess so. I don’t know. They were like, fine, but they weren’t anything special.
Chris [00:09:37] Now, when their- when their kids take off down the mountain, maybe you haven’t given them the thumbs up to take off yet and you realize they’ve taken off and you’ve got to chase them down the mountain… you find yourself in a situation where you are quite literally Keeping up with the Kardashians.
Caller [00:09:56] (LAUGHS) I’ve never thought about that before.
Chris [00:09:58] You can use that.
Caller [00:09:59] That’s hilarious.
Chris [00:09:59] You can use that. Feel free.
Caller [00:10:01] I’m, I’m going to use that. Maybe I’ll put that on my business card next year.
Chris [00:10:06] Yes. Boom. That’s why people call the show. They don’t want to air out their stories. They just want buzzwords and catch phrases from me for a potential business card usage. Because, you know, there’s a lot of businesses out there in the world. Speaking of which, many of those businesses advertise on our show. Check out these ads and we’ll be right back. Thanks again to our advertisers who help bring the show to the world. Now, let’s get back to the phone call. You can use that. Feel free.
Caller [00:10:42] I’m going to use that. Maybe I’ll put that on my business card next year.
Chris [00:10:47] Yes.
Caller [00:10:50] Yeah, that’s actually hilarious. Yeah. Honestly, not that hard to keep up with because they just sort of stand still and talk to each other a lot. So it was more trying to get them to move a little bit. But I was quite literally Keeping Up with the Kardashians.
Chris [00:11:09] I will say I, I was quite struck, she did an episode of that- David Letterman has a show on Netflix where he interviews people and he interviewed her and she spoke so eloquently about wanting to free prisoners who were unjustly imprisoned. She talked about, like their family’s legacy in the law and how she was trying to pursue it. And I was like, I got to say, for someone who’s known largely through a reality show, and someone who partially came into prominence due to a leaked sex tape, which I think was very un- that’s- I think that’s brutal whenever that happens and then the slut shaming that surrounds it is awful. I did not anticipate to be sitting here some day and going, wow, Kim Kardashian is impressing me and has some things to say that are really making me think. And kudos to her because you can tell that at the very least, despite any faults and of her background, she’s trying to be a good person, it seems.
Caller [00:12:21] Yeah, I, I, I, I agree. I think that she it seems like she’s trying to do some good stuff. And to be honest, I don’t keep up with that part of the world very much and pay much attention to it. It doesn’t carry tons of interest for me, like, you know, big time celebrities and stuff in general.
Chris [00:12:42] Well, have you heard about, have you not have you heard about Kanye? You say you don’t keep up with any of this. Imagine if I was like, oh, wait, oh, wait, are you how off the grid are you? Because I got something to tell you about a guy you used to hang out on the mountain with. That’s gotta- that has to be weird to see. And look, we’re laughing about it. There’s some nervous laughing there. Also want to say, as someone who has, you know, dedicated a decent amount of energy in my life towards destigmatizing mental health issues, you know, I’m far from the per- I’m far from the first person here to go, it seems like this person is having some some issues in that realm. And I’m not trying to laugh at that, but must be weird for you to hang out with someone for a chunk of time and then see them, you know, precipitate a career downfall with bizarre rants about the Jewish people.
Caller [00:13:38] Yeah, no, it’s definitely weird. And I mean, I totally feel for like, understand and recognize that, like, there must be some real shit going on there that, you know, I, I’m sure that most of us don’t even know the beginning of. Um. And… It is never, I don’t know, it just can’t be a justification for, you know, perpetuating hateful speech. But it is like, weird to know that we spent a couple days together shooting the shit in the mountains, so. Yeah, but I, as with most people, I just like hope that he is able to get the support and help that he needs and hopefully not do that on a super public stage where people are, you know, holding him up on some kind of pedestal.
Chris [00:14:38] I really hate it. I really hate it. I love how you just phrased that. These things don’t need to happen on a public stage. They do too often. There’s so many things- and I guess it’s been going on my whole life, but it feels so much more pronounced now. There’s so many things that we treat as entertainment these days that I don’t think are very entertaining. Like people having mental breakdowns, people’s lives and careers being ruined. I also will say, you know, it’s huge in the podcasting world. And I mean, I’ve gone on record many times and said my favorite podcast is Criminal. I think that’s a very smart and well put together show. But you forget like even the past five years, like the amount that true crime has become entertainment, but so much of it is just, hey, here’s you want to hear a story about someone who got their head chopped off and thrown in a river? Here it is. I’ll read the Wikipedia entry on that. But no actual, like, nuance or subtlety. Just here’s the most shocking messed up things that we can treat as entertainment. Here it is, everybody. Here’s a reality show where people never see each other and then they get married so you can watch the train wreck. Here’s the Tiger King. What else can we just throw at you? What else can we just throw in your face? Just what other sensory overload can we have that is… Humanity not at its best that we treat as entertainment? I find it very icky.
Caller [00:16:15] Yeah, I totally agree. And it’s like so easy to hide behind a screen and just like forget the humanity in all these situations and the nuance and the complexity and to sensationalize. And I wish that we sometimes I wish that we could just go back to reading really fascinating novels and books and all of that because, yeah, it just goes overboard. But I don’t know, I used to be I used to get all hung up on stuff like that. And, you know, you find yourself like nose in the screen and I think in the last couple of years I’ve just, I don’t know, it’s so much more worth one’s time to actually connect with those around you and connect with nature and connect with the world, like the real world, as opposed to sort of this fleeting entertainment of stories that you don’t even know the full truth of.
Chris [00:17:12] Yeah. Yeah, to get some sense of validation or some sort of dopamine rush.
Caller [00:17:19] Exactly.
Chris [00:17:22] From those things. And then realize, Oh, I haven’t, I haven’t talked to any of my neighbors in four days. I haven’t, I haven’t, I haven’t been outside during the daylight hours in a week. You know? These are real things that we put ourselves through.
Caller [00:17:35] Yeah, that’s, like, terrifying.
Chris [00:17:37] Did you say your parents were diplomats? Did I catch that?
Caller [00:17:42] Yeah. So yeah, they have been at times. Yeah.
Chris [00:17:47] And you mentioned at the very- this lifestyle was part of why you grew up in Switzerland?
Caller [00:17:54] Yeah. Um, yeah, my parents are, well, they’re, they’re doctors, like originally, professionally and have sort of migrated into the public health sphere. And one of my parents, like we’re here for their job and or they’re here, I guess, for their job in Switzerland doing public health, global health work. So, yeah, that’s kind of the world I grew up in.
Chris [00:18:30] Wow. It’s intense stuff.
Caller [00:18:32] It is, especially since COVID. Very intense.
Chris [00:18:37] I’ve always wondered.
Caller [00:18:38] Yeah.
Chris [00:18:40] You hear about people who grow up and, you know, your parents work as doctors and in the global health sphere, it you’ve said it they have worked in the diplomatic sphere. Either way they are they are world travelers who on some level are representing America. I’ve always wondered about growing up this way because someone who’s a diplomat is working as a representative of America. And they believe in it. And they… I mean, you can’t paint everybody with the same brush, but I have to imagine nobody’s going to uproot their life and live in a foreign country working on behalf of a government and not on some level believe in the concept of America. And then you as their children… or their child, are raised in a different culture in foreign soil, very disconnected from America, but inherently American because your parents are representing the country. That’s always seemed fascinating to me, and I don’t think I’ve ever talked to anybody who grew up with that set of circumstances.
Caller [00:19:52] You know, it’s such an interesting question, and I’ve honestly never heard anyone frame it that way. So I so appreciate that.
Chris [00:19:59] Look, I’ve been doing this job a long time.
Caller [00:20:06] Yeah, I, it is so interesting because I don’t know that I’ve ever heard my parents frame it that way or talk about it. And to be totally honest, I think that some of their career choices were- this is going to sound cynical- but like some of their career choices were to create opportunities for them to move their family outside of the US. Um and a lot of these moves were not necessarily for the job itself, but for, like as a means to the end of getting their kids outside of the U.S. And at this point, like I am, so I have a I have a brother also, and I’m the only one of our family of four who lives in the U.S. and and probably like the rest of the three of them probably will never live in the U.S. again. My brother lives in the U.K. and obviously my parents in Switzerland. So, yeah, I think they had, well, one of my parents is Canadian, too, so we’re kind of half and half. And they met when they were living in the Caribbean. And so they’ve, like, traveled and lived in a whole bunch of different places. And I think it’s been there’s like, especially on my dad’s side, who’s the American side, like several generations actually, of trying to leave the U.S.. Unsuccessfully until now, I guess. Um, and it has been like such a weird transition also being the only one in my family who lives in the U.S still and has that connection. And I have so many, so many thoughts and uncertainties about how long that’s going to last for me. And why I’m still there um, beyond just like being far away from my family. And yeah, I think in some ways it’s been this like very long process of trying to get out of the States, especially because my dad’s like, my dad is African-American and um, I think there’s, you know, given just like the generational trauma of black people in the U.S., I think there’s been sort of this like existential desire to leave that country, but also an inability to do so. So yeah, it’s been kind of this like crazy, yeah, like very existential and emotional process. And my parents were very, very intentional that they didn’t want me and my brother growing up in the States. So in some ways it’s like the biggest thing right now is that I went back to the US and have made a little life there for myself, at least as of now. I’m still pretty young, so who knows how long that’ll last. But yeah.
Chris [00:23:16] That’s one of the more layered and interesting answers to a question I’ve ever received on the show. Thank you for it.
Caller [00:23:25] You’re welcome. Sorry I sorry I didn’t have a more straightforward, straightforward answer.
Chris [00:23:34] No, who wants a straightforward answer? You kidding me? You think I want a straightforward answer? No, we, I like the layers around here. Layers to this stuff.
Caller [00:23:49] Well, there’s a lot of them, so yeah.
Chris [00:23:53] Wow.
Caller [00:23:54] But. Yeah, I guess it’s a good point that I’ve never thought about in terms of like that on some level going into that line of work there was some belief on their part in the US in the context of global health and. And also just using it as a vehicle to get school paid for and, you know, get us out.
Chris [00:24:21] Wow. So was it so when you went back, were your parents like, What are you doing? What are you doing? And what year did you move back to the States?
Caller [00:24:32] I moved back to the States in 2016.
Chris [00:24:37] You moved back to the states of 2016 when your parents were wary of America and its politics? And you said, 2016, this seems- everybody chill. It seems like now’s the time to head back. If you’re worried about American politics, don’t worry, everybody. I got a great feeling about 2016!
Caller [00:24:56] Oh my god. Yeah, not an ideal time to go back, that’s for sure. That was kooky. And I was in college, so I was like, so confused about everything that was happening and, like, just starting to figure out my adult life and my adult mind and, you know, how the world works when you’re no longer a child, too. So that was crazy. But I think like, given that I’m the older of the two siblings, it was always just, I don’t know, I didn’t even like think. It just sort of like made sense to go back to the U.S. for college. I didn’t really know what else to do. I guess I kind of just got stuck. I shouldn’t say stuck there. I’ve made choices to be in the U.S. also since then, but kind of also just kind of got stuck there.
Chris [00:25:52] This is a fascinating- how? Stuck stuck there how?
Caller [00:25:56] Not stuck, like, like not literally stuck, like, existentially stuck. You know, like you start creating a life and building community and having stuff, and I don’t have a visa or a passport to live back here. And then during COVID, I was like literally stuck there because I wasn’t allowed to come home for all of COVID pretty much.
Chris [00:26:24] When you say here because you are currently in France, do you mean here being Europe?
Caller [00:26:28] Oh. Yeah.
Chris [00:26:29] Yeah. Walk me through this.
Caller [00:26:31] Here being Europe. It’s all so close. Like the distances to drive here between countries are shorter than within the state they live in. So, yeah.
Chris [00:26:44] So. So you were saying you didn’t have a visa to work in Europe, so you’re not a European citizen?
Caller [00:26:50] I’m not. No. I’ve always been here on, like, children of diplomat visas. So now I’m just a regular old tourist, so I don’t have the right to work here. I wasn’t allowed to come during COVID. My mom put in some like, special application and she was like, I need- it was like a, I need to see my baby visa. So. Yeah, but it’s been sort of this, like, weird long process and all of a sudden I’m like seven years into living in the US again. And it’s hard to leave, hard to pull oneself away from community and like a little life that I’ve started building, which is just very far away from home at this point, but also a new home. So, so many existential crises. And I’m in my I’m 25 and I feel like that just feels like prime time for all the existential crises. So.
Chris [00:27:53] You’re how old?
Caller [00:27:55] I’m 25.
Chris [00:27:56] 25. So you moved back when you were.
Caller [00:28:02] I was 18.
Chris [00:28:02] 18. Wow. And 25 is a prime time for existential crises, but you’ll have more when you’re 32. And from what I can tell, all of your forties.
Caller [00:28:15] Well, shit.
Chris [00:28:17] Yeah.
Caller [00:28:19] I was hoping this was going to be the worst of it.
Chris [00:28:21] It’s some of the roughest. They all take on different forms. But, yeah, 32 shit’s going to hit the fan again. Then you’re going to have a lot of fun in your late thirties, and then your whole forties you just sit here you go, why did I make every choice I ever made? That’s my the sense I get. That’s the sense I get.
Caller [00:28:43] Okay, well, maybe, maybe it’s about like your fifties and sixties, you know? Maybe that’s when, when you look back and say those are my best years.
Chris [00:28:54] Maybe that’s when things just really chill out. Who knows? Who knows?
Caller [00:28:59] Yeah, I don’t. Seems like everyone’s in the middle of an existential crisis, but I guess I’ve seen the world. So.
Chris [00:29:07] Always.
Caller [00:29:08] Everyone’s got something.
Chris [00:29:09] You’ve uh I got to say, you’ve been a lot of places and seen a lot of things for somebody who’s 25.
Caller [00:29:16] I have. I feel very, very lucky that I have had those opportunities and had the chance to live in a bunch of places and travel to a whole lot more and made tons of different kinds of people. So I feel super, super lucky about that. I. Yeah.
Chris [00:29:40] Okay.
Caller [00:29:40] I think I don’t know it feels so critical to be able to know that there’s a whole world out there, not just one’s own little my own little bubble and circle. But it’s easy to get wrapped up in that, I guess.
Chris [00:29:55] Can I ask- I’m going to ask a tough question and a sensitive question, but one I’m sure you’ve had to think about a lot. So.
Caller [00:30:04] Hit me.
Chris [00:30:05] Grew up overseas, talked about how your parents like to travel. Caribbean, France, Switzerland, all these places, they’ve they’ve used their careers specifically as a way to remove themselves from some of the aspects of American politics, especially, I believe you said your dad as an African-American. I have all those details right?
Caller [00:30:26] Mm hmm.
Chris [00:30:28] You move back in 2016. And I was joking about it, you know, mostly because, you know, the big headline there is Trump, but not just Trump. There’s also been so many things that have happened since you moved back to the States that specifically must be things that your father turns around and goes, That is why I left. I mean, George Floyd, the most notable example, but sadly, far from the only one. And I believe was was Elijah McClain in Colorado? Am I remembering that right? It’s sad that there’s so many that I that you can’t recall all the details right away. But I mean, it is is there part of you- does your dad call you up when when these things happen? Is your dad going, Why are you teaching people to ski in Colorado? We got out of there. Get out of there. That’s why I wanted out of there. Got to say, out of all of the cases that have led to so much rage that- if you’re not familiar with the story of Elijah McClain, I’ll just say Google it. It was one of those that was most heartbreaking and infuriating to me. Not that it’s a contest. There- there’s so many. It’s so sad. But man, did that one get me. Anyway, we’re- it’s getting sad. I’m getting sidetracked. We have ads. Let’s go ahead. We’ll take a breath. We’ll take a break. We’ll be right back. Thanks to all the advertisers who help us make this show happen. We’re very lucky to have you. And now we’re very lucky to finish off this phone call. Why are you teaching people to ski in Colorado? We got out of there. Get out of there. That’s why I wanted out of there.
Caller [00:32:20] Yeah, um like we have never had that conversation, like, super directly. And I think that’s mostly just part of his both life and parenting philosophy. That said, like, you know, he, you know, is committed to supporting me in whatever, you know, wherever I want to be and whatever I want to do, which again, I feel so lucky about. But I think that is something that we have definitely talked about in less overt or direct ways, but is like super real. And it was like I guess like last year, for example, we he flew I had a long drive to do up to northern Wyoming and he flew over and hung out with me for a little while in Colorado and then helped, you know, made the drive with me. And he was like freaked- we drove through this part of Wyoming that I’ve heard is like the least densely populated area of the lower 48, like, you know, absolute middle of nowhere, nothing around except for just like ranches. And that’s about it. And he was like, freaked out at the idea of, you know, anything like the car breaking down or anything. He’s like, I’m going to get shot. Which was terrifying. And yeah, I was that was like a super, I don’t know. It was just like a freaky moment and something we hadn’t really talked a lot about before. But also, I think- and I can’t speak for him obviously, but is another like complex part of his identity because he’s, he is mixed and I think he’s always had this internal, mostly internal battle about whether he fits in with the black community or whether he’d, you know, he grew up in a very white area with a white mom. And so whether he is more white and also just with and like these like just circulates in really white groups and worlds and I think that, yeah, he’s definitely expressed to me his distaste for being in the US and his feeling of just being really unsafe in ways that he doesn’t feel unsafe in Europe. So yeah, it’s definitely at least like a choice that he’s made for himself to not be in the US anymore because it’s dangerous for him, both on an everyday level and just to conduct ones full life in the US. It was really dangerous at this point. So.
Chris [00:35:32] Layers. Every answer you give. Your ans- I mean, every answer you give… Layers.
Caller [00:35:44] A hell of a lot of them. Yeah. I have a lot of complexity in my family background, for sure. So I’ll peel it all out and figure it out.
Chris [00:36:01] I bet growing up the way you did means that you know how to roll with a punch. And I bet you you must know how to talk to people in a way that I’m pretty envious of.
Caller [00:36:15] I guess. I guess in some ways, yeah, I, I definitely love connecting with people who are, you know, just come from all over the place and have all these different experiences. And I wish I was better at it because I am pretty shy and, you know, sort of I don’t know, I wish I was better at asking people questions and, and unpacking stuff.
Chris [00:36:50] All right.
Caller [00:36:52] Yeah. But it is a cool way to connect with people in terms of all these different lived experiences people have.
Chris [00:37:05] And I have to imagine. Okay. Let’s let’s go back to this. You mentioned you mentioned Kim and Kanye swing by the resort you work out of. Now, those are flashy names to drop. They certainly grab one’s attention. It also speaks to the overall culture of where you’re finding yourself these days. Like, there are probably people who are not household names who have even more money than Kim and Kanye that are coming through wherever you’re working. Because Kim and Kanye don’t just drop by a place where people like me are slumming it. So are you around uber wealthy people all the time in Colorado now?
Caller [00:37:45] All the time. Yeah. And most of the time I probably don’t even know it, to be totally honest. But yeah, I mean, we have a ton of celebrities who have, like you know, celebrities like that who have homes there, but also these like ultra wealthy people who, in my opinion, have a lot more money than brains and just do really absurd, absurd things with their time and money. And it’s hard to even understand, you know, people who get helicoptered in from five star resorts in the middle of nowhere to the resort and uber uber wealthy homes and incredibly high cost of living. And that’s like another factor where I live just because it’s so saturated with the ultra wealthy that people like me who aren’t the ultra wealthy have a very hard time figuring it out and finding places to live and having a life that is sustainable in any way at all. I just someone just texted me that currently where I live a head of lettuce costs $13. And that’s sort of where things are at right now.
Chris [00:39:05] $13 for lettuce?
Caller [00:39:08] Yep.
Chris [00:39:10] Wow.
Caller [00:39:10] Yep. So there’s like, this super cool community of, like, awesome, rad, dirtbag young people and we, you know, do all kinds of outdoorsy stuff and hang out in the mountains and go be weird hippies at weird music festivals. But it’s also not an easy place to have a normal life as someone who’s not a multimillionaire.
Chris [00:39:40] Those legalized edibles. Those legalized edibles. Sometimes that’s all that can get you through these days, I bet.
Caller [00:39:50] Yeah, that too. Yeah.
Chris [00:39:54] It helps when you’re dealing with some rich dickhead in a helicopter. I’m sure it helps.
Caller [00:40:01] It definitely does. The employee housing is at the base of the mountain, so most people head home for a quick bong rip before their afternoon of work.
Chris [00:40:11] Really?
Caller [00:40:12] Yeah.
Chris [00:40:13] Yeah. And that’s not even really a thing. That’s not even really a thing anymore. How silly is it that that’s still a thing in some places? Love the vibe. I said it in the beginning, and I still do. Love the vibe. Now you’ve referred to yourself as a dirtbag twice and your friends as dirtbags, and I’m wondering exactly what that entails.
Caller [00:40:34] I say so very affectionately. I just mean that, well, I don’t know. I guess, uh. I guess it just entails like going to the desert and camping and, you know, not not caring what we look like. And I definitely am on the- I’m one of the lesser dirtbags of the bunch, but just like silly shenanigans and long hippie hair and people who live out of their cars and vans and travel around and do seasonal work and pretty much just like chase whitewater and snow and mountains. I don’t know if you’ve ever heard of that podcast, The Dirtbag Diaries, but those are the kinds of people I hang out with a lot. So but I don’t know, I’m like that type but then I’m also like, I love and I’m one of the bougier dirt bags. I love fashion and shoes and nice clothes and stuff. So I guess the (UNCLEAR) in me is still present.
Chris [00:41:58] You walk between worlds.
Caller [00:42:01] I do. I do. In so many ways.
Chris [00:42:07] It sounds like it’s another skill that one develops being being a child of expats. I bet. I bet that idea of walking between worlds is a skill you develop and a necessity to a degree.
Caller [00:42:19] Yeah, it totally is. It really, really is. And I think that’s why so many kids who are like the children of expats call that- they call themselves third culture kids.
Chris [00:42:31] Third culture kids?
Caller [00:42:32] They have this third- yeah.
Chris [00:42:35] Oh, that’s a sick name for a band right there. The Third Culture Kids.
Caller [00:42:40] That would be, wouldn’t it.
Chris [00:42:46] I can hear it.
Caller [00:42:47] Yeah.
Chris [00:42:48] If someone hasn’t gotten to that, you’ve got to start a band called the Third Culture Kids, please. It’s a great name.
Caller [00:42:55] Put it out there to the universe for someone to start making super eclectic mix of genres type music.
Chris [00:43:05] There’s a whole Wikipedia entry on the idea of a third culture kid. You’re a third culture kid, someone who is raised in a culture other than their parents or the culture of the country of nationality, and also live in a different environment during a significant part of their child development years.
Caller [00:43:20] Yep. That sums it up.
Chris [00:43:23] You’re a TCK.
Caller [00:43:25] TCK’s. Yeah. And they gravitate towards each other. There are communities, like almost in every big city I bet you’d find. Just this group of kids who all went to international schools. Each hold about 3 to 4 passports, speak upwards of four or five languages, have a super obscure accent that you can you can’t pinpoint to any exact place. And they all gravitate towards each other and they all already know each other. It’s like a whole it’s a whole community. It’s a whole thing.
Chris [00:44:02] Wow.
Caller [00:44:03] Like among those kinds of people, I’m one of the most boring by far.
Chris [00:44:11] And you’re not very boring at all, so this must be an exciting group of people.
Caller [00:44:15] It’s a cool group of people. When I walked into my first day of school at the international school I went to for high school, I think people were asked to go around and introduce themselves. And it’s totally typical. Like one kid’ll introduce themselves and be like, Hey, I’m Johnny and I’m, I don’t know, I’m from Argentina. And then the kid next to him goes, No you’re not. Your mom is Irish and your dad’s from Ghana. Like, what are you talking about? It’s so typical.
Chris [00:44:47] Now, you like being a dirtbag rolling with the dirt bags, people living out of vans. You also like shoes and fashion and a good fancy meal.
Caller [00:44:59] Yeah.
Chris [00:45:01] I feel like you’ve made. You’ve laid out. I’m going to ask, and I’m not suggesting anything untoward happens here, but you’ve laid out that like you’ll throw down, get in the van, go exploring, do the outdoor stuff with the dirt bags. You made that clear. I have to wonder, does being around these absurdly wealthy people ever afford you access to that other side of your interests? Like, are you rolling with the dirt bags during the day and then, like, going out to a restaurant with some billionaire at night? Have you ever had a night like that?
Caller [00:45:33] Yeah.
Chris [00:45:34] Yeah?
Caller [00:45:34] Yeah, it’s epic. Yeah. People invite you to dinner all the time. They think you’re fun and young and cool, which is somewhat true. But also, you know, everyone can be. And people invite you out to dinner, invite you to go heli skiing. I’ve had clients invite me.
Chris [00:45:55] Heli skiing?
Caller [00:45:55] Yeah. I’ve had clients invite me to travel with them to other countries to go skiing. So it’s pretty awesome, actually. Like you just get treated to all this cool stuff. And especially since you know the area.
Chris [00:46:12] Heli skiing like he- is heli skiing like you jump out of a helicopter and you’re on skis?
Caller [00:46:17] I wish. Well, yes, but you don’t jump. The helicopter takes you up to like more remote areas than you could get to on a chairlift or by foot, and then it drops you off and you just ski and you just go. It’s amazing.
Chris [00:46:33] And I have to ask more. I’m just going to get to the nitty gritty. When this shit starts happening, there’s two schools of thought I have. One is like, there’s some rich family that goes, Oh, you’re a great instructor. Can we contract you to just stick with us for the next two weeks and you come with us wherever we go? And then blah, blah, blah. And then there’s also, I would imagine, are there like rich dudes that are like, you’re 25 and you seem cool. Can I take you out to the best meal of your life?
Caller [00:47:01] Oh, my God. Chris, I wish. Um, you know?
Chris [00:47:05] You wish the billionaire men were trying to scoop you up?
Caller [00:47:07] I mean, I wouldn’t be upset. That would be great. I’ve never had that happen. I mostly teach kids or teenagers, so I usually it’s more usually like the family route for me. But hey, like, if any billionaire dudes want to take me out to fancy meals and treat me, I mean, I wouldn’t say no.
Chris [00:47:36] So you’ll be teaching a family’s child or children, and then the father or mother might casually turn around and go, Well, you know, we’re actually going heli skiing tomorrow. Maybe you could join us for the heli skiing, which I have to imagine, to basically be able to rent a helicopter to take you skiing in a place where ski lifts don’t access… This is not a cheap or easy thing to attain. So it’s more stuff like that?
Caller [00:48:02] Pretty much exactly. So it usually goes like you do a good job teaching their kids, they think you’re cool, they take you out for drinks that night, and then they’re like, Hey, by the way, we have an extra spot for tomorrow. You want to come heli skiing? And you’re like, Yeah, I do.
Chris [00:48:19] And next thing you know, you’re in a helicopter going to some cliff face that’s inaccessible to to poor people? Skiing on this virgin snow?
Caller [00:48:28] Yeah. Sounds terrible, doesn’t it? Yeah. No, it’s, it’s awesome. It’s pretty sweet. That’s the part, that’s the part of life where everyone in town who actually lives there, like young people like me, we say, My life is better than your vacation. Because that’s what it’s about. But then, you know, the season ends and you realize you’re all of a sudden out of work and have no money left. So there’s that part, too.
Chris [00:48:59] Now, can I tell you something about me?
Caller [00:49:03] Yes, please.
Chris [00:49:03] Never been skiing once in my life. Zero interest. Yeah. I don’t think- I’m going to say something That might be the type of thing that people are like, you’re an idiot. My impression? Growing up, Irish Catholics don’t ski. We got enough. We constantly think the world is falling apart. I’m not putting myself in an avalanche situation. I don’t need to be driving around with one of these backpacks that inflates when the avalanche comes. You know those things?
Caller [00:49:31] Yeah, I do. Luckily, I’ve never had to use one. Okay, so what? What can I do to convince you to try skiing?
Chris [00:49:40] I’m a 42 year old man with terrible knees and a general feeling that a rock is going to fall on my head at any given moment. Explain to me. Explain to me. Give me the elevator pitch on why a guy in my- of my ilk and worldview should, in his forties, get into skiing. Also, is it bad on the knees? Because I got bad knees.
Caller [00:50:02] Yeah. I can’t help you on the knees front. If it makes you feel any better, I have bad knees, too. Well, I guess it’s from skiing. That’s not a very good pitch, is it? Okay. Okay, picture this: you go on vacation with your family, you pack up all your warmest winter gear, you go to a beautiful resort somewhere out west in the Rockies. It’s a winter wonderland. It’s sunny, the trees are covered in snow, everything’s glittering. And like there are Christmas lights up everywhere, even in February. And you hire a really patient, really lovely instructor, and you put on your skis and you learn on the bunny slope and there’s nothing that dangerous about it. Your knees are crushing it. They’ve never felt better. That’s not really true. But um…
Chris [00:51:07] Yeah, this- that’s bullshit. Now I know you’re just a liar.
Caller [00:51:10] The rest of it is true, I promise. And then you go in for a nice lunch at the chalet and you eat.
Chris [00:51:20] A chalet? If I ever stepped foot in the chalet, I’d start, like, cleaning dishes. I feel like I’d be like, How can I, how can I help? I’m not a chalet person. Can you imagine, honestly, I mean you’ve listened to the show at least a couple times if you left a voicemail. Can you imagine me in a chalet? Honestly?
Caller [00:51:41] Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Listen, you got to try you got to try everything once, right? That’s my philosophy. You try everything once, and then you can decide.
Chris [00:51:53] Sounds cold and expensive, skiing.
Caller [00:51:55] Yeah. Yeah, There’s no way around that. But it’s worth it. Like, there’s there’s just, like, a beauty of gravity sport where you just let gravity do it all for you. That’s the fun part for me.
Chris [00:52:10] Let me ask you this. Companion question, and I can’t believe I’m finally going to ask someone in my life… How does someone get into the sport of ski jump? Because the first time you try that, it must be the most insane choice you’ve ever made. Every time there’s a Winter Olympics, I think about this. Do you know ski jumpers?
Caller [00:52:31] I actually don’t know any ski jumpers, but it’s honestly, like, seems terrifying to me, too.
Chris [00:52:34] Who are these people? Like if you don’t know them, where are they?
Caller [00:52:40] I don’t know. I don’t know. They’re off in the middle of nowhere, hauling themselves off a 20 foot propeller jumps. I have no idea. I don’t know where the ski jumpers are.
Chris [00:52:53] How the hell does someone get into ski jumping? I’m just gonna launch myself into the sky down the side of a mountain. How do you do that the first time? I don’t understand who these people are or where they come from.
Caller [00:53:06] I don’t either. I feel like they’re just like a whole nother breed. I don’t understand that at all.
Chris [00:53:12] Yeah, you might- must get the crazy snowboarders, though.
Caller [00:53:15] Yeah. No, we do have some. We do have some awesome snowboarders, and that’s some of the stuff they do I just can’t even understand. I’m completely like, yeah, there are a few Olympians who hang out at the mountain and some of the stuff they do I can’t even begin to understand. But I feel like that’s just a lot of testosterone and peer pressure at some point too.
Chris [00:53:42] Two of my least favorite things.
Caller [00:53:45] Yeah. Same.
Chris [00:53:45] Testosterone and peer pressure. Well, you’ve really sold me on skiing.
Caller [00:53:52] I know, but it’s about the family experience. That’s what it’s all about.
Chris [00:53:57] My kid would probably like it.
Caller [00:53:59] Like enjoying.
Chris [00:53:59] He’s a daredevil.
Caller [00:54:00] There you go. It’s about enjoying a day in the mountain. You know, like a cool way to see new places. And like I said, gravity sports, like there’s something satisfying about just letting gravity do the work.
Chris [00:54:14] Have you ever eaten it to a concerning degree? You ever had you ever had the ski patrol have to come get you?
Caller [00:54:22] Luckily, no. Touch wood. I hope that doesn’t ever happen. But no, I, yeah, like I have, I’m, my knees are already not very happy with me. So I try to be I try to be like pretty as careful as I can be whilst still having fun. But luckily I’ve never had to be in a ski patrol sled. I have had a few clients unfortunately who have. But yeah, luckily that’s never happened. I. I obviously know a lot of people. I was dating someone who crushed his face on a tree. That wasn’t great. Yeah. And had to have like reconstructive surgery. But no, luckily I’ve never had like a major injury. Thank goodness. I also don’t think that my health care is good enough to be able to afford that. So. Another reason to leave the US so I don’t have to worry about that sort of things.
Chris [00:55:38] Yeah. Yeah. God bless you. Third culture kid flinging herself down the side of a mountain, hanging out with dirt bags and occasionally billionaires. Life could be worse.
Caller [00:55:53] Life could be a lot worse. Yeah. I don’t know how long this is going to last, though. I feel like I- you actually, you said in an episode that aired somewhat recently and I don’t remember which one, but that you were thinking about going back to graduate school. And that resonates a lot. And I’m curious what you’re thinking about going back to graduate school for, because I, you know, my body won’t last forever and I’m- as much as I, you know, my life sounds pretty carefree and fun right now, but I was also like, the straight-A nerd student who did really well in school and had a pretty, you know, one of those big fancy colleges. So. That’s another thing that I’m thinking about.
Chris [00:56:37] Hmm. I’m thinking about social work. And do you want to hear an update?
Caller [00:56:45] Yeah.
Chris [00:56:47] I found out yesterday I have been accepted to graduate school. I haven’t decided if I’m actually gonna go.
Caller [00:56:53] Whoa, congratulations.
Chris [00:56:54] Thanks. I don’t know if I’m going to go.
Caller [00:56:56] Oh, my gosh.
Chris [00:56:57] But I’ve been accepted.
Caller [00:56:59] Whaaat.
Chris [00:56:59] Now I have some big choices to make.
Caller [00:57:00] What are the pros and cons?
Chris [00:57:03] Well, the pros are some sense of accomplishment and stability and feeling like it’s an opportunity to do some good, possibly. The cons are that it might represent me giving up on a lifestyle that I’ve spent my whole adult life building that was something of a dream that went pretty successfully, and I’m worried that I’m quitting in a way I’m going to regret. I’ve also had some interesting developments where I have I wound up talking to talking to someone about this who works in a world where they said they might be able to give me a job where I might be able to accomplish a lot of the good side of it without needing three years of schooling and financial aid. So that’s another thing. A major life, major area of life transition here. Major area of life transition. I’ve got enough life transitions happening without all of a sudden taking up skiing.
Caller [00:58:03] Fair enough. That’s a lot. That’s so- so I’m also thinking about applying for a masters in social work.
Chris [00:58:14] Really?
Caller [00:58:14] And I’m very on the fence about it.
Chris [00:58:16] Yeah, right? It’s a hard life. God bless all the social workers. I know a ton of them listen to this show. You read the description of this job. You go, it sounds like such a noble thing to do where you’d feel like you were helping people legitimately. Also, sounds difficult emotionally, mentally, and honestly, financially.
Caller [00:58:36] Yeah. No, it does. It sounds really taxing. Like it could be really taxing and also really rewarding. And I. But I don’t know that many people. I mean, I know a few, but not tons of people who do that kind of work, but I feel like that’s in some ways like the pinnacle of morality. And on some level, I shouldn’t say that. That’s a bit dramatic, but it’s super cool the way people dedicate their lives to that kind of work. You know, that it’s not all, you know, it doesn’t sound like it’s the most lucrative, but just opens so many doors that are really important and really interesting work.
Chris [00:59:21] Yeah, I bet you’d be good at it.
Caller [00:59:25] I don’t know. I would hope so. But it’s also yeah, it’s like a big life change. It’s a big financial commitment. It’s a big time commitment. And graduate school just sounds like a, I mean, it’s just like such a real investment on so many levels that you have to be pretty sure it sounds like that that’s something you want to do.
Chris [00:59:50] You and I are on the same page. Here I thought our lives had very little in common as far as actual lived experience. Then it turns out we’re thinking of the same exact career change.
Caller [01:00:00] Yeah.
Chris [01:00:03] So we’ve got 30 seconds left. I got to wonder, you mentioned that you feel like after- yeah, I know, right? After seven years here, you feel like a little bit like you’ve a little trapped. Do you think you’re going to stay in the States or do you think that you’re a you’re your family’s tradition of, uh, of wandering is it going to take back over at some point?
Caller [01:00:22] I think I think I’m going to end up leaving the States. I’m sort of thinking that graduate school might be my avenue out. And I don’t know that it’s for exactly the same reasons that they decided to leave, but honestly, I just feel so far away from them that it feels like it’s a priority for me to try to be physically closer so that I don’t have to just see them once or twice a year.
Chris [01:00:53] It’s an intriguing note to end on. A cliffhanger. What will happen to this caller? I guess we’ll never know because our time is up.
Caller [01:01:02] Aw. Well, that went by so fast. Thank you so much for your time and for such a lovely conversation.
Chris [01:01:10] Thank you so much for calling and for chit chatting with me. We went in a whole bunch of different directions. I really loved it. And I wish you nothing but the best.
Caller [01:01:19] Thank you. You too, Chris. Have a good afternoon.
Chris [01:01:28] Caller, thanks so much for getting me through just such a lovely conversation. Just a lovely laid back conversation that I feel truly lucky to have had. Thank you. Thank you to Anita Flores for producing the show. Thank you to Jared O’Connell for engineering the show. Our theme song is by Shellshag. Go to ChrisGeth.com if you want to know more about me, including all of my upcoming tour dates. And wherever you listen there is a button that says subscribe, favorite, follow. When you hit that button, it helps us so much. If you’re looking for merch like T-shirts and stuff, go to podswag.com. It’s all there. If you want your episodes without any ads, you want to go to Stitcher.com/premium. You can use the promo code “stories” for a one month free trial.